ronin my intention was not to spread fud but to tell the truth all my point was to say ,that the one post seemed to suggest going to an area 10000 ft without enough backup clothing in my opinion. my fearmongering is not that ,you could not tell a new driver that it is not dangerous on the roads. as you said many people end up in trouble even with the proper gear the point i was trying to make at the end of my post is that you must be very knowledgeable in order to keep your self warm and not to let the cold creep in and stay aware of your personal condition as it is very easy to miss the initial signs and maybe your only chance. cold weather camping is very beautiful but does come with it,s own dangers that is reality.no you may not nessacerily die if you are poorly prepaired but who wants to take that risk. knowledge is knowing when you are getting into trouble being properly prepared for it and utilizing what ever you have or can use to remove yourself froms harms way.