Jim, I've found on my Fall bp trips, even into highly popular areas, not many people there in early Oct. The main group that I have gone with on bp trips the last six years post over on Facebook now, I don't like the place, so I am mostly back to solo bping or staying home. What a difference. Two years ago, I was out at least one night each month, last year, barely a dozen and a half nights maybe between bping and car camping.