Hello,

A couple years ago I was part of a trail crew and spent about 5 months camping (so i'm pretty good with the outdoors life). During my time I fell in love with the idea of backpacking. So this coming summer my lady and I are planning a one month trip on the Sheltowee Trace trail as a prep for a longer trip, possibly AT the next year. The only problem is I know nothing of the gear and I just get flustered trying to sort out the differences in the millions of options. None of the gear I used camping would be any help backpacking because of size and weight so I was hoping for a little guidance.

Firstly I wanted to ask about tents, most of what I was seeing has been recommending the Big Agnus Copper UL3, but when looking just recently I've been seeing a lot about this Sierra Designs Lightning XT 4. The XT 4 is cheaper and but I read that it takes a good amount of pack room, while the Big Angus is smaller, more expensive and possibly less durable. My parents offered to get me a tent as an Xmas gift but I wasn't sure what to choose. Does anyone have advice on these two or a third that might be a better fit for two people?

Thanks, I'll bug you about pads, bags and stoves later.

You might take a look at the Tarptent offerings, and also the MSR "Fast and Light" line - particularly the Hubba Hubba and Carbon Reflex 2. Just remember that "lightweight" and "cheap" aren't going to occur in the same product description.

The best two-person shelter I have ever used is our Six Moons Designs Lunar Duo. The second best is our Tarptent Rainshadow (note this is a different tent than the Rainbow.)

http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/shop/shopexd.asp?id=47
http://www.tarptent.com/rainshadow2.html

Both of these are single wall shelters made of silicone nylon, with good ventilation, huge amounts of room, great weather protection, complete bug protection, and they weigh about 2.5 pounds total. Having used many shelters over the years, these are my favorites for two or more people.

Not to favor one over the other, but FYI: Six Moon Designs is having a holiday sale right now--15% off.

Have you checked out the articles and gear lists on the home page of this site? They're listed in the left hand column. Lots of great information there to help you! Another good site for gear info is Mark Verber's site.

I'd also like to suggest my own site--we have a short discussion about tents there, along with the rest of the gear you'll need.

http://www.backpackthesierra.com/home/equipment/tents

I would suggest that you start slow, and see what works. I am amazed at the amount of backpacking equipment I see for sale cheap, because somebody bought the wrong thing.

What's thte best tent for you? All tents are a compromise between protection and weight, and the solutions range from no tent at all to a full blown 4-season wonder.

Start by defining what kind of camping you'll be doing, and under what conditions. Then take a gut check and ask yourself what your wife/SO will need to be happy.

Then look at your wallet, and weigh your backpack. And you will have a good idea of what tent to get!

Thanks everyone for the suggestions and links. Right now i have a Kelty Santa Fe 4000 that i've had for years, its in good shape but it is heavy. I haven't actually decided whether or not i will get a new pack for my hike coming up this year.

I suppose the hiking i will be doing would be three season moderate weather stuff. I don't see myself going out when its getting lower than 40 at night. I wanted to leave around April/May for the 3-4 week hike through Kentucky and my lady is a little hesitant about possible rain. She really wants to go but doesn't have much experience roughing it.

I'm working my way through looking at the links provided but any further advice is appreciated.

I also wanted to mention since this board seems mostly geared toward ultralight I'm not really looking for ultralight hiking personally. Though I am a very small guy (140 lbs) and my lady is as well, so we would like to stay comfortable so we are trying to keep the weight down.

We aren't an ultralight site here, more like light weight. The UL folks who try to exist with 5-lb. baseweights hang out at Backpacking Light. I for one would not be able to backpack were it not for the suggestions for lightening up on this site. I do insist on some creature comforts (like a nice thick supportive sleeping pad and a nice warm sleeping bag), so I'll never be ultralight!

You can be lightweight and still be very comfortable!

It's not necessary to go ultralight. You can put together a reasonably light set of three-season gear from "mainstream" manufacturers for about 15 pounds; add another 15 - 20 pounds for a week's worth of food and fuel and a quart or two of water, and you're still under 35 pounds which isn't unbearably heavy.

If you're going to be out for 3 or 4 weeks, you'll have to resupply every 5-7 days, anyhow. More frequent resupplies help keep down weight, but also add time to the hike because you're getting on and off the trail more often.

Grunt
I guess somebody has to say this, but you said your lady isn't very experienced and is worried about rain. I guess you haven't had the time to really study and think about the proliferation of posts here however: There is something we call the BIS syndrome that's (boot in shoulder) syndrome. That's when you take a gal out on a trip that she isn't prepared for and the BIS is followed immediately with "Get me the hell out of here," and that becomes both of her trail experiences, her first and her last. Maybe you should forget the gee wouldn't it be great to do a long trip fantasy and maybe try some 2 day trips in rain and other real learning experiences before planning a 3-4 week trip.
Just my $.02 worth
Jim

Jimshaw

Perfect advice. I could not agree more.

My wife and I car camped for years (before and with kids) before I finally convinced her to go on a short backpacking trip: three days. Five miles in, set up base camp, spend a day wandering around and relaxing, and then five miles back out on the third day. It was perfect.

So perfect that we came home, restocked our packs, and left the next day for a 32 mile four day trek through the high country of Yosemite. And we haven't slowed down yet---last year we hiked 200 miles.

The best pack trips of my life have been with my wife...but like everything else in marriage, you have to take it slow, and be willing to compromise.

After all, isn't that how we ourselves eased into backpacking?

Here is my sequence - let's see if it brings back memories

1) day hikes - they get longer and wind up coming back in the dark.

2) the realization that it would be easier, more comfortable, and would open up more country to stay out overnight. On my first overnight, our packs were so small, and our gear so heavy, we had to make two trips to "base camp" to get it all in...

3) survival and improvement of techniques - still continuing today - and progressively improving techniques

Well, not all of us.

My first "campout" was with a young men's organization, the Air Force ROTC. As part of our summer camp (basic training), we were marched out into the local state park boonies with a parachute section and some C-rats (I was guessing my dad ate from the same lot on Guadalcanal.) We learned how to rig the parachute section as a tarp, with some sticks, and some other rudimentary survival tricks (not nearly enough depth to be called "skills.") It was a pleasant evening, all in all, until the storm blew in...

Fast forward a dozen or so years, to my son's first chance to go on a backpacking trip to Cumberland Gap National Historical Park - 25 miles, forced march, one overnight on the mountain, no tents, ramen noodles for supper. The only way the troop would let him go (he was a couple months shy of minimum age for the trip) was if I went along. So I did, dumb and happy ("fat" was still a few years off.) It was tough, but I had a great time, it didn't rain, and a few weeks later I had read The Complete Walker and headed out for my first solo weekend, with a tarp and my e-frame pack. Never looked back - and have enjoyed every minute of it.

My son never really got into it (he prefers kayaking), though we still go out every couple of years for a weekend together.

As Jim explained, my wife never did get the hang of it...

I was looking into the Lunor Duo and it seems great but I've herd condensation gets to be a pain in single wall tents. Have you had any problems in it?

I like the idea of freestranding more but i really like the weight and price of that tent.



Thanks again guys, I understand the Wimp Out concern, but we've gone hiking and camping a couple weekends to see how she likes it and she wants to try more. We just never had the misfortune of getting bad weather on our trips, while it may be a deciding factor its one we'll just have to figure out.

bad weather can turn out to be a plus factor. The trips I remember are those with the added challenge of adverse elements...

I was once a wife whose husband refused to backpack or even to car-camp where he couldn't get his daily shower.

My own experience with single vs. double wall tents was that I got even more condensation in the double wall (Sierra Designs Clip Flashlight). It had an outward-slanting screen door, so the vestibule had to be closed up tight in the merest drizzle. The result was horrendous condensation on the underside of the fly which leaked through the inner tent, leaving big puddles on the tent floor and my sleeping bag. At least with the single-wall tent, the condensation is accessible to wiping down!

There are ways to mitigate condensation in a single-wall tent which are described on the Tarptent and Six Moon Designs websites. It also helps me if I can wipe the walls down in the morning before my dog (mostly Lab) wakes up and starts wagging his tail! Ventilation and avoiding low-lying campsites are the main key, as true with a double-wall tent as with a single-wall.

I have friends who bought a Tarptent Double Rainbow with the extra internal canopy (which catches most of the condensation) and think it's wonderful! They spent 5 nights above timberline (no trees to pitch it under) and freezing or close-to-freezing nights with it last summer and had no problems. They said that with the internal canopy it was as good as a double-wall tent.

Mouse
I have a Sierra Designs Flashmagic - its the single wall version of the clip flaslight. Its still my favorite summer tent at 51 ounces wih stakes and it must be nearly 20 years old. The door - I hesitate to call it a vestibule, must be pulled out and fastened to close but there is 10 inch gap under it for ventilation and a covered rear vent. I always carry a microfiber hair drying towel with me and wiping up the tiny bit of condensation above me, which rarely occurs, is easy.

I have camped along side two people in a double walled tent (in the flashmagic) and the next morning when they pulled off the shell it was covered with ice underneath, had the sun shone on it, it would have melted and dripped back into the inner tent, only as a liquid not as a gas.
Jim