allright, I've started replying to this thread twice now, and decided I shouldn't be so negative and tossed it twice...

Now I'm not gonna.

Some of you know my "boy scout" aversion. apologies to all those current scouters in advance. I think what you are doing is noble, and needs to happen.

I think you guys were all (fortunately) before my time a bit. lucky for you.

I went through scouts in the late 70's. - like 79. by this point they had as a matter of policy esposed "lnt" (sic) to the point where you had to run a line under your tent during the day so as not to leave the ground trampled. however the gear of the day, combined with worrying about kids whining or parents complaining, or god knows what, meant we ended up carrying the kitchen sink.

Some of us, even at that age (especially the run the line under the tent crap) thought... "what a crock".

Probably combined with bad gear, fear of litigation, and god knows what else (heck I was 10/11..) I remember we couldn't chop anything, burn anything, or do anything remotely "traditional" that I always did when I just went out with my dad. (thank god for that). The leaders did inordinate gear checks to ensure I was carrying enough stuff for "safety" (translation, kid from city not whining.. aka 4 changes of clothing on a three day trip, enormous stove and pan, food just like at home, god forbid you make a fire, etc. etc. ) that I recall carrying a bonecrushing weight of a pack and was completely miserable most of the time.

In retrospect, St. Colin should have been required reading for
them at the time. I'm certain it wasn't.

I hike today *in spite* of my boy scout experience, not because of it. My father, friends, and hard knocks taught me less is more a little later in life.

And yes, I am reminded, put up or shut up phat. I should find a local scout group to volunteer with. I have not yet. I need to do that....