Backcountry Forum

Make Your Own Gear

Amazon.com
Backpacking Forums
BackcountryGear.com
backcountry gear

---- Our Gear Store ----
The Lightweight Gear Store
 
 ULTRA-LIGHT 

Ultralight Backpacks
Ultralight Bivy Sacks
Ultralight Shelters
Ultralight Tarps
Ultralight Tents
Ultralight Raingear
Ultralight Stoves & Cookware
Ultralight Down Sleeping Bags
Ultralight Synthetic Sleep Bags
Ultralight Apparel


the Titanium Page
WM Extremelite Sleeping Bags

 CAMPING & HIKING 

Backpacks
Tents
Sleeping Bags
Hydration
Kitchen
Accessories

 CLIMBING 

Ropes & Cordage
Protection & Hardware
Carabiners & Quickdraws
Climbing Packs & Bags
Big Wall
Rescue & Industrial

 MEN'S APPAREL 

Jackets
Shirts
Baselayer
Headwear
Gloves
Accessories

 WOMEN'S APPAREL 

Jackets
Shirts
Baselayer
Headwear
Gloves
Accessories

 FOOTWEAR 

Men's Footwear
Women's Footwear

 CLEARANCE 

Backpacks
Mens Apparel
Womens Apparel
Climbing
Footwear
Accessories

 BRANDS 

Black Diamond
Granite Gear
La Sportiva
Osprey
Smartwool

 WAYS TO SHOP 

Sale
Clearance
Top Brands
All Brands

 Backpacking Equipment 

Shelters
BackPacks
Sleeping Bags
Water Treatment
Kitchen
Hydration
Climbing


 Backcountry Gear Clearance


 WINTER CAMPING 

Shelters
Bivy Bags
Sleeping Bags
Sleeping Pads
Snow Sports
Winter Kitchen

 SNOWSPORTS 

Snowshoes
Avalanche Gear
Skins
Hats, Gloves, & Gaiters
Accessories

Stay Healthy--Eat Well

MARY JANES FARM ORGANIC MEALS

Mary Janes Farm Organic Backcountry Meals

NATURAL HIGH GOURMET MEALS

Natural High

 

Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#162097 - 02/13/12 03:43 PM MYOG White Gas Stove?
BZH Offline
member

Registered: 01/26/11
Posts: 829
Loc: Torrance, CA
I have noticed people on these forums seem to talk affectionately of two stoves: (1) SVEA 123 and (2) MYOG Alcohol Stoves. I don't have any hands on experience with either of these, but it always makes me wonder why people don't do a MYOG white gas stove. I guess white gas needs to be pressurized which increases complexity, but if I understand the Svea correctly it doesn't have a pump. It is pressurized by a pre-heat tube. Is a white gas burner like the svea too dangerous or just to complex to make yourself? Has anyone tried?

Top
#162126 - 02/13/12 08:50 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: BZH]
PDA Offline
member

Registered: 10/05/10
Posts: 75
Look at the complexity of the tubing and burner design of liquid fuel stoves and the standard of brazing required, to say nothing of drilling the jets, adn you can see why MYOG is not really an option for LF stoves.

Top
#162135 - 02/13/12 10:33 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: PDA]
Gershon Offline
member

Registered: 07/08/11
Posts: 1109
Loc: Colorado
I have a SVEA 123 and will not use anything else.

Lots of people have tried to make their own white gas stoves. Problem is, homemade ones tend to blow up. One thing the SVEA has is a pressure relief valve in the cap. A person making their own might not think of this.

_________________________
http://48statehike.blogspot.com/

Top
#162137 - 02/13/12 10:47 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: Gershon]
TomD Offline
Moderator

Registered: 10/30/03
Posts: 4963
Loc: Marina del Rey,CA
I own three white gas stoves-a SVEA 123, a MSR XGK and an Optimus Nova. Take a look at all three and compare them with an alcohol stove made out a soda can. How many people do you know have the engineering skills to make one of mine? I would suspect that is a very small number who have not only the skills, but also access to the machine tools and materials. Making a white gas stove is like making a homemade jet engine, because that is pretty much what they are. Kids, don't try this at home (rocket scientists excepted).
_________________________
Don't get me started, you know how I get.

Top
#162150 - 02/14/12 12:24 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: TomD]
BZH Offline
member

Registered: 01/26/11
Posts: 829
Loc: Torrance, CA
Thanks for the reply's everyone. I guess they are just too complex to make yourself. I've been thoroughly impressed with all of the mad scientists in the MYOG community that it seemed odd no one was trying to build these.

Actually my first thought was, "I wonder what would happen if you throw white gas in an alcy stove?" I assume it would either turn into a spectacular fire ball or just barely burn (not really sure which though). With two little boys at home my own mad scientisting has really been hampered lately.

Top
#162156 - 02/14/12 01:29 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: BZH]
PerryMK Offline
member

Registered: 01/18/02
Posts: 1153
Loc: Florida panhandle
If you have your heart set on a multi-fuel stove, probably the safest (I use that word loosely; burning ignitable liquids is inherently unsafe) design is something like this. It is basically a non-pressurized wicking material. Spill almost anything ignitable on it and light. It might flash a little so maybe do this from at least arm's length (smile).


Top
#162160 - 02/14/12 02:42 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: BZH]
TomD Offline
Moderator

Registered: 10/30/03
Posts: 4963
Loc: Marina del Rey,CA
Originally Posted By BZH
Thanks for the reply's everyone. I guess they are just too complex to make yourself. I've been thoroughly impressed with all of the mad scientists in the MYOG community that it seemed odd no one was trying to build these.

Actually my first thought was, "I wonder what would happen if you throw white gas in an alcy stove?" I assume it would either turn into a spectacular fire ball or just barely burn (not really sure which though). With two little boys at home my own mad scientisting has really been hampered lately.


Doing what you suggest is extremely dangerous. Yes, you will wind up with a fireball and the chances of you getting badly burned are probably close to 100% unless you did this under controlled test conditions. Alcohol is nowhere near as volatile as white gas and has far less energy, which is why starting an alcohol stove isn't all that easy sometimes.
_________________________
Don't get me started, you know how I get.

Top
#162165 - 02/14/12 03:51 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: PerryMK]
BZH Offline
member

Registered: 01/26/11
Posts: 829
Loc: Torrance, CA
Thanks for the link Perry. I note how explicitly Paul conveys that this should only be used with alcohol. I guess based on Tom's response if you were to try throwing white gas in there you would get a nice pretty fire ball and no boiled water. It seems white gas is so energetic that you have to meter how much fuel comes out. Restricting the flow of a combusting fuel is how you make a bomb.

There was this wicked looking alcy stove that some guy in Japan made with bent tubes with wire mesh inside for wicking the alcohol. It seems to me you could use a similar concept to regulate the flow of white gas, ..... but as I mentioned (with two little ones at home) I don't experiment as much as I used to and I note how people who actually use white gas and alcohol stoves think this is a pretty awful idea.

Top
#162178 - 02/14/12 05:37 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: BZH]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
My first thought upon reading the subject before clicking on the thread was, "I hope he has a fire extinguisher and a real close fire station, and the phone dialed up with 9-1-1, before he lights it."

yeah, probably not a great idea.
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

Top
#162179 - 02/14/12 05:56 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: BZH]
Jimshaw Offline
member

Registered: 10/22/03
Posts: 3938
Loc: Bend, Oregon
BZ
PM me and allow me to email photos to you.
Have you seen phats little swiss stove? There are many many variations.

Oh and TomD is right (he set his kitchen table on fire testing a stove as I recall) don't try this at home, HOWEVER if you can braze and have a torch, saws and a way to bend copper tubing and cut threads - and a nice lathe - go for it. I wish I had a torch and a lathe - I'd be making miniature white gas stoves.
Jim


Edited by Jimshaw (02/14/12 06:00 PM)
_________________________
These are my own opinions based on wisdom earned through many wrong decisions. Your mileage may vary.

Top
#162181 - 02/14/12 06:19 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: Jimshaw]
Kent W Offline
member

Registered: 10/15/09
Posts: 607
Loc: IL.
Amen Lori, Basically that would be compared to building a Bomb! It could very easily become one! Naptha, coleman fuel is intensly volitale!

Top
#162191 - 02/14/12 11:17 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: Jimshaw]
TomD Offline
Moderator

Registered: 10/30/03
Posts: 4963
Loc: Marina del Rey,CA
Jim is right, I set an XGK on fire when the fuel tube wasn't properly sealed to the pump and the pump caught fire. It was on cutting board on a countertop and I put the fire out quickly with little damage, but a few more seconds and I could have had a full blown fire in my kitchen. So, no more testing indoors for me. Alcohol stoves, way safer.

When I was a kid, I set a coffee can about half full of gas on fire in my folk's garage-not intentionally. Put that out with a fire extinguisher.


Edited by TomD (02/14/12 11:18 PM)
_________________________
Don't get me started, you know how I get.

Top
#162199 - 02/15/12 07:52 AM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: Jimshaw]
Gershon Offline
member

Registered: 07/08/11
Posts: 1109
Loc: Colorado
SCUD missile fuel is a very good subsitute for an ESBIT tablet. It will boil 2 cups of water almost instantaneously, melt the pot into molten metal and set the tent on fire.

Don't ask me how I know that.


Edited by Gershon (02/15/12 07:52 AM)
_________________________
http://48statehike.blogspot.com/

Top
#162215 - 02/15/12 11:30 AM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: Gershon]
BZH Offline
member

Registered: 01/26/11
Posts: 829
Loc: Torrance, CA
Originally Posted By Gershon
SCUD missile fuel is a very good subsitute for an ESBIT tablet. It will boil 2 cups of water almost instantaneously, melt the pot into molten metal and set the tent on fire.

Don't ask me how I know that.


I definitely know what solid rocket fuel will do:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WsVzpE7ltb8

My company had several rental cars melted during that failure. Their are pictures of pools of metal in the parking lot that used to be a car. "Yes, Hertz, I'd like to rent another car. The one you previously gave me? You can come scrape it off the pavement."

Top
#162338 - 02/16/12 06:41 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: BZH]
PDA Offline
member

Registered: 10/05/10
Posts: 75
The engineering equipment and skills are above those that most of us have. Pressure liquid fuel stoves (such as the SVEA 123) are simple, but devilish to get the proportions correct, and machined accurately. Otherwise, a piece of cake. As someone said elsewhere, if you do meddle, do any testing outdoors, in, say, the driveway, two houses down the street.

Top
#162382 - 02/17/12 05:03 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: PDA]
skcreidc Offline
member

Registered: 08/16/10
Posts: 1590
Loc: San Diego CA
Some of you are still trying to commit myog white gas stove suicide, huh..... Well, take a lesson from the "home made" cap and ball gun crew. When I finished (I worked in a machine shop) my replica Colt Navy .36, I had to test it out to make sure the thing wouldn't explode in my face. It was pretty if I do say so myself, brass frame, nice blueing job. So, I attached it to a tree fully loaded with twice the powder load in EACH cylinder (capped with grease of course). Tied a string to trigger and pulled the hammer back and walked a fair distance away to hide behind a boulder. Then I yanked on the string to fire the thing off. You never know, the thing could have chain fired and I could be known as stumpy.

Moral is "test first" at a safe distance.

Top
#162412 - 02/17/12 11:57 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: BZH]
Samoset Offline
member

Registered: 07/04/08
Posts: 429
Loc: Newnan ,GA
Originally Posted By BZH
Thanks for the reply's everyone. I guess they are just too complex to make yourself. I've been thoroughly impressed with all of the mad scientists in the MYOG community that it seemed odd no one was trying to build these.

Actually my first thought was, "I wonder what would happen if you throw white gas in an alcy stove?" I assume it would either turn into a spectacular fire ball or just barely burn (not really sure which though). With two little boys at home my own mad scientisting has
really been hampered lately.


Out of curiously I once " in a controlled environment " filled a super cat stove with whit gas and placed a stainless steel messkit pot on it. The two cups of water build in prob 3 min. But I never used that water or the pot or stove again!
_________________________
Some peopole live life day by day. Try step by step.

Top
#162436 - 02/18/12 02:07 PM Re: MYOG White Gas Stove? [Re: BZH]
GrumpyGord Offline
member

Registered: 01/05/02
Posts: 847
Loc: Michigan
Gasoline requires the correct air and fuel mix. Depending on several hard to control factors, what you can get away with one time may kill you the next time. If the vapors on the surface of a can of gasoline are not the right mix it is possible to extinguish a lighted match in a can of liquid gasoline. This is not to likely to happen but is theoretically possible. Do not try this at home.

Top

Shout Box

Highest Quality Lightweight Down Sleeping Bags
 
Western Mountaineering Sleeping Bags
 
Lite Gear Talk - Featured Topics
Bivvy Sack combo Arrangement
by Jim M
10/18/17 01:58 AM
what is the lightest framed backpack around 40L
by toddfw2003
10/16/17 07:23 PM
a worthy challenger to the msr pocket rocket2
by the-gr8t-waldo
10/16/17 01:28 PM
Backcountry Discussion - Featured Topics
Napa Fires
by balzaccom
10/11/17 07:43 PM
Backpacking the Ouachita Trail thanksgiving
by toddfw2003
10/05/17 11:54 PM
Rockfalll on El Capitan in Yosemite
by balzaccom
09/28/17 09:47 AM
Make Your Own Gear - Featured Topics
alcohol stove comparisons
by Bike_packer
10/03/17 08:56 PM
Can footprint plasticizer harm tent ground-sheet?
by Weston1000
09/10/17 02:24 AM
Featured Photos
Breakneck Ridge, New York
May 2012 Eclipse, Lassen Park
New Years Eve 2011
Trip Report with Photos
Seven Devils, Idaho
Oat Hill Mine Trail 2012
Dark Canyon - Utah
Who's Online
0 registered (), 21 Guests and 0 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Blackbuzzard, LivelyLiz, Weve, Tones21, Pasquale
12424 Registered Users
Forum Links
Disclaimer
Policies
Site Links
HOME
Backpacking.net
Family Hiking
Lightweight Gear Store
Backpacking Book Store
Lightweight Zone
Hiking Essentials

Outdoor Gear Daily Deals
Outlets, Sales, Bargains

Our long-time Sponsor, BackcountryGear.com - The leading source for ultralite/lightweight outdoor gear:

Backcountry Forum
 
 

Since 1996 - the Original Backcountry Forum
Copyright © The Lightweight Backpacker & BackcountryForum.com