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#131114 - 03/23/10 12:42 AM Making my own wood gassifier stove
Pat-trick Offline
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Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
I used the Garlington url's, and some others, to make a prototype gassifier stove today, because the Bushbuddy costs $200 with the titanium pot made for it! I found an old piece of galvanized duct work today, and dug a can out of my trash, and I made a double-walled gassifier that is closed at the top of the walls, so that all the heated air has to go into the secondary combustion area. It has a false bottom with tons of holes for primary combustion air, some holes in the sides, and then the major holes 3" above the false bottom for secondary combustion air. My test burn today, using half wet wood, showed that I needed more combustion air. I'll do a burn in the morning, with my watch, and a quart of cool water in a two quart pot. My goal is to boil in a reasonable amount of time, say 10 minutes, and hold the boil for 20 minutes if possible. That way I can make lentils and potatoes stew. Here's a poor picture of it, 'cause the only camera I have is built-in to my monitor. When I get it working, I'll use aluminum flashing to make the outer wall, and keep the 28 oz Progresso Crushed Tomatoes can for the burn chamber. It's 4" diameter, and 4 and 5/8" tall. I cut about a 1/4" off the height.

I found that I really enjoyed tinkering with this project. It was fun, and the time just flew on by. it was even fun squatting in my yard in the rain, watching the thing try to catch on fire. With all the extra holes I gave it, it ought to do much better tomorrow. And hopefully I'll find some dry wood!

Let's see if I can figure out how to add the picture.


Well, I didn't figure out how to do it. It looks like I uploaded the picture, but I don't see it.


Attachments
prototype.jpg


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#131115 - 03/23/10 12:44 AM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: Pat-trick]
Pat-trick Offline
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Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
Oh, there it is! It shows up after submitting the post. Yay!
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#131196 - 03/24/10 03:23 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: Pat-trick]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
So far I've gotten up to 150 with the 4" diameter stove. the pot puts the fire out, but when i take the pot off, the fire comes back. it's not getting enough air.
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#131214 - 03/24/10 07:29 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: Pat-trick]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
SUCCESS!!

I did 4 things differently, and got a rolling boil at 10 min 30 sec.

1: opened the top of the double-wall for air flow through that space, in hopes of improving air flow into the secondary combustion area.
2: made sure no wood was bigger than a pencil, and mixed in quite a bit of smaller. all dry.
3: stopped loading at the low edge of the four secondary venturis. I had loaded up to the top before, an additional 1.5".
4. measured the quart of water, 32 oz. I had been using a bigger pot, and probably more like 2 quarts.

I got the boil without using a lid.

Had some smokiness from 5-8 minutes.
Went into charcoal burning, no flames, at 15 min. Temp 206
temp 206 at 20 min. The fire burned non-stop. (It had gone out several times each testing before today.)

Next time, I'll load predominantly pencil size sticks (1-2" long), with small ones at the top.
I'll also use a lid on the pot. And I'll stick around after 20 min to record temps, etc. I had to go walk before it got dark today.

Tomorrow I will also buy a taller 4" diameter can at the grocery store, for testing with a bigger batch of wood (same diameters though).

Anybody have the perfect wood-burning stove, home-made?
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#131243 - 03/25/10 10:07 AM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: Pat-trick]
finallyME Offline
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Registered: 09/24/07
Posts: 2710
Loc: Utah
So, did you consistently feed it, or just fill it once.
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#131263 - 03/25/10 07:23 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: finallyME]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
I filled it just the one time, shook it to settle all the pieces, dribbled alcohol on the top, and lit it.
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#131349 - 03/27/10 01:04 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: Pat-trick]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
Back to the drawing board...

I want to bring a quart of water to a boil and keep it there for 30-45 minutes. A one-batch gasifier won't do that.

Today I added a better bottom screen (1/2" hardware cloth as opposed to can top with holes drilled). I also added a 2" collar and put the pot stand on that. That collar concentrated the gases and flames and made a BIG difference. However, I had to add wood continually and had quite a bit of smokiness. So...

I'm thinking to put the secondary air holes at the top of my tomato can (4.5" as opposed to 3"), so that my firebox will be 50% bigger. With the collar on top of that, that might give me better results. Also, I'm going to try bigger wood, placed vertically to improve air flow through the fire. I tried finger sized sticks 3" long, and they burned great (big flames) once they got going. I think it may be possible to add a stick every minute to keep the fire going without smoke, thus I can cook raw beans if I want. Yes, I like to sit around the fire and cook!

Stay tuned.
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#131357 - 03/27/10 05:18 PM Holy Moly [Re: Pat-trick]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
I discovered something today. I removed the bottom of the can, and put in a 1/2" hardware screen. Then I raised the can off the ground, used the collar, and discovered a wood blow torch! A quart of water boiled in 5 minutes flat, and all the wood was consumed in 9 minutes! I'll attach a picture.

My next step is to use a bigger can so I don't have the separate collar. A 7 or 8" tall can, 4" diameter, will do it. I'll use the bottom 2" for the stove stand and adjustable intake openings. That way I can tone it down a bit. No sense in having flame higher than the pot. Then it will need a combination windscreen/secondary air heater, which can be aluminum flashing material. the whole thing ought to be light as the bushbuddy, I would think. I think it will be able to boil at least 2 quarts of water for as long as anyone would want, or short time, too.

I don't remember how to add a picture!

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#131359 - 03/27/10 05:22 PM Re: Holy Moly [Re: Pat-trick]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
OK, use File Manager. Here's the pic.


Attachments
holymoly.jpg


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#131360 - 03/27/10 05:30 PM Re: Holy Moly [Re: Pat-trick]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
and this one shows the screen at the bottom of the can.

I will find a can big enough to act as bottom intake, to replace that wire thing, and also as pot stand, to replace the wire at the top. It will be solid. The bottom 1.5" will have adjustable intake. The screen inside will be heavier duty.


Attachments
HolyMolyBottomScreen.jpg


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#131379 - 03/28/10 09:41 AM Sunday Morning Report [Re: Pat-trick]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
I fashioned an air intake controller - very rough - but it worked, and it made a difference. One quart of water came to a rolling boil at 11:00 flat. It had started to burn too fast, and I restricted the air, and the flame stayed on the bottom of the pot. My apparatus this morning wasn't readily adjustable, but if it had been, I would have been able to make minute adjustments to it to keep the flame just so.

There was a lot of blue at first, and then the flames were bright orange. I need to experiment with the stove screen: spacing, height, openings, etc. But the intake adjustment gizmo will be super.

I fed a couple sticks per minute into the stove and maintained a smoke-free rolling boil for 35 minutes. There was little wind, and I didn't use a pot screen. I discovered that there was an easy rythym of adding sticks, and that this stove likes sticks about finger size. I had to use my pocket knife to score around the bigger sticks and then snap them - just barely! Used to be I could snap small trees with my hands, now I have to use a knife on kindling. I'll for sure need this knife in my gear list. Might even sharpen it some.

My design shows a stove that will be 4" in diameter, with 3 pieces that use tabs and slots to twist and lock into place. The total height from ground to pot bottom is 9 and 1/2". The three sections and the stove screen will dismantle and fit inside the 4" diameter can with a 4 and 5/8" height. The three parts will be made of tin cans. I fit the 1/2" hardware cloth better, and it may do. There's no other wire, no nuts or bolts, duct tape, or gum. The sucker ought to be light. Sorry, no picture today. It's too ugly, being patched and wired together for testing of this and that.

Okay, off toward Jay Mountain for a little test of the legs. Wish I had a cannister so I can take some cold coffee and my pocket Rocket with me. This test wood stove is a big rattly, falling-apart conglomeration of rusted old crap I found laying around in my basement. ha. It would rip my Miwok or fall apart and get lost somewhere. But it's perfect for experiments.

Okay, I'll add a picture I took for a friend last night, maybe two.


Attachments
3.jpg


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#131814 - 04/08/10 09:25 PM Re: Sunday Morning Report [Re: Pat-trick]
larebow Offline
member

Registered: 06/19/02
Posts: 36
Hey pat-rick hows the stove coming along?

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#131911 - 04/11/10 07:56 PM Re: Sunday Morning Report [Re: larebow]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
Oh, thanks for asking, I didn't report my last test run. It was after an all-nite rain. I found some "dry" sticks at the base of trees, etc, and got a fire going with great difficulty. I had to use huge amounts of alcohol, and over a 45 minute period I did get a fire going, but it wouldn't handle the air flow being diminshed, as for example, when the pot was on the stove. Since that day, I haven't done anything, because.... well... that wet day put a "damper" on my enthusiasm for a wood stove. I may get back to it shortly.
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#138857 - 09/15/10 11:28 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: Pat-trick]
NorthTxHillbilly Offline
member

Registered: 09/15/10
Posts: 67
Loc: North Central Texas
Any new news? I'm looking for good advice on a small homemade wood burning camp stove design for an upcoming hiking/camping trip I'm gonna take with my wife and our dog. We're relatively new to hiking but I have lived on the family cattle ranch since I was in elementary school so I'm no stranger to nature.... The wife grew up in the country, too. Usually we take my truck and go to the same places that hundreds of other people camp at but this time we're planning to hike about an eight mile trail and camp at the midway point. Mainly I'm interested in minimizing weight. Any new info on the stove would be greatly appreciated, because I'm going to an area that has plenty of twigs and don't want to have to carry alcohol or cut wood. Your stove sounds perfect for what I'm planning to do.
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#138859 - 09/15/10 11:34 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: NorthTxHillbilly]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
Originally Posted By NorthTxHillbilly
Any new news?


There are so many tiny details in the wood stove's construction, that are determined by trial and error. The closer I get to a design that works, the closer I get to the Bushbuddy design. So I decided to just buy a Bushbuddy. They have lowered their prices, and you can now get one out of stainless steel, about 5 ounces, for about a hundred bucks. I'm getting one with my next check. I think Bushbuddy has worked out all the details, while I haven't.
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#138862 - 09/16/10 01:02 AM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: Pat-trick]
NorthTxHillbilly Offline
member

Registered: 09/15/10
Posts: 67
Loc: North Central Texas
That's a bummer, I'll have to experiment at home a bit, but then again I'm not doing a several day hike with possibly wet wood. If its gonna rain, we're staying home, so with some experimentation and your previous advice, I should be able to make something work. Thanks!
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#138868 - 09/16/10 10:10 AM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: NorthTxHillbilly]
finallyME Offline
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Registered: 09/24/07
Posts: 2710
Loc: Utah
You can make a stove that works by just cutting a can up. It won't be as efficient as a bushbuddy, but who cares, you aren't carrying the fuel.
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#138870 - 09/16/10 11:35 AM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: NorthTxHillbilly]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
you can find pictures of the bushbuddy on their site, and using a ruler, you can measure the dimensions of their various parts. if you can reproduce what they made, you'll have a stove that works.
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#138880 - 09/16/10 01:31 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: finallyME]
phat Offline
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Registered: 06/24/07
Posts: 4107
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted By finallyME
You can make a stove that works by just cutting a can up. It won't be as efficient as a bushbuddy, but who cares, you aren't carrying the fuel.


And you can leave the cut up can at home, use three rocks you find locally to put your pot on, and not carry any stove either wink

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#138893 - 09/16/10 04:14 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: phat]
Pat-trick Offline
member

Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 175
Loc: Portland, OR
Originally Posted By phat


And you can leave the cut up can at home, use three rocks you find locally to put your pot on, and not carry any stove either wink



There IS a danger of starting a below ground fire when using an open fire pit on top of the ground. There are layers of dead material that can catch on fire, or simply smolder. We hear stories about smoldering underground fires in the news all the time. I like the idea of the contained wood fire, and especially in something like the Bushbuddy that has double-wall construction. I don't think anyone who uses this forum has ever used one for backpacking, because I've asked for reviews and haven't gotten a single one. In fact, there's been lots of resistance to the idea of using the Bushbuddy or other home-made wood stoves. But, I've heard in other places on the internet that the thing does work. It can be used for boiling water, or some prolonged cooking, or simply for the pleasure of a "campfire". Keeping the fire from contacting the ground makes it safe for the planet. The double-wall construction provides a pre-heated secondary air source for more complete combustion of the wood, and results in pretty much a smoke-free fire. I've gotten that with my own incomplete version of the double-wall Bushbuddy. If anyone decides to use it, they ought to bring a back-up stove, either alcohol, or propane, or one of the many others. Like for when it's solid pouring rain for 3 days. BTW, it's not a wood gassifier technically. It just gives good combustion of wood.
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#138933 - 09/17/10 12:23 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove/"FLAME wars [Re: Pat-trick]
CamperMom Offline
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Registered: 01/04/02
Posts: 1228
Loc: Eastern MA, USA
Hi, Guys-

If we start to debate the merits of 3-rock fire lays VS contained fires and protecting the plane, will we be in danger of starting a "FLAME WAR" here?

LOL!

CamperMom

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#138946 - 09/17/10 06:02 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: Pat-trick]
phat Offline
Moderator

Registered: 06/24/07
Posts: 4107
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted By Pat-trick
Originally Posted By phat


And you can leave the cut up can at home, use three rocks you find locally to put your pot on, and not carry any stove either wink



There IS a danger of starting a below ground fire when using an open fire pit on top of the ground. There are layers of dead material that can catch on fire, or simply smolder.


Sure, if you build your fire on a layer of organic materiel - but this really depends upon where you are. If I'm building my fire on sand, or rock, or clay, or gravel, it's just not the case.

Is it *appropritate* to have an open fire everywhere? heck no.
many places it would definately leave a trace, and many places the act of scavenging for fuel everywhere would adversely affect the place. Similarly flying embers could light fires in very dry places. Places like that are also no place to use a wood stove either.

Quote:

We hear stories about smoldering underground fires in the news all the time. I like the idea of the contained wood fire, and especially in something like the Bushbuddy that has double-wall construction. I don't think anyone who uses this forum has ever used one for backpacking, because I've asked for reviews and haven't gotten a single one. In fact, there's been lots of resistance to the idea of using the Bushbuddy or other home-made wood stoves.


And you've hit the nail on the head - this is a lightweight backpacking forum.I *DO* use a wood fire in *some* places i go where it is appropriate to do so, when I do though, and I'm carrying an alky stove or canister stove for the other times.

Much of the time I am out, I am in sensitive areas in the alpine. in those places I will not use wood, even in a stove.

Coastal hikes with driftwood everywhere? heck, fire on the beach time. no need for a stove there.. high tide and winter storms make it pretty much no trace.

Quote:

But, I've heard in other places on the internet that the thing does work. It can be used for boiling water, or some prolonged cooking, or simply for the pleasure of a "campfire". Keeping the fire from contacting the ground makes it safe for the planet.


It can keep it safe if you want to have a fire on top of a duff layer. Anywhere else, well, the planet has been burning for long before humans - I doubt it will care.

Quote:

The double-wall construction provides a pre-heated secondary air source for more complete combustion of the wood, and results in pretty much a smoke-free fire. I've gotten that with my own incomplete version of the double-wall Bushbuddy. If anyone decides to use it, they ought to bring a back-up stove, either alcohol, or propane, or one of the many others. Like for when it's solid pouring rain for 3 days. BTW, it's not a wood gassifier technically. It just gives good combustion of wood.


I agree completely. The engineer in me loves the things - I love to tinker with them. My only issue with them is the practiality of using them for backpacking in most situations. For me, it's simply a case of:

1) in many situations where I should not have a wood fire, I shouldn't use this either.

2) In situations where I can have a wood fire, I can have one without carrying this.

3) For all other situations, I need a stove.

4) There are concievably some situations where I could use this where I could not have a wood fire. I concede it's possible, and always have. I just haven't encountered such situations, in a lot of backpacking.

5) given the rarity of 4) above, and the fact that for the weight of your a 5 ounce stove I have stove, stand, and 2 to 3
days of fuel for two hot meals a day for one person, I just can't manage myself to make the weight tradeoff - even for the coolness factor.

The most common thing for me to do is have a few places where wood fires are possible, and then adjust my stove fuel load accordingly.




Edited by phat (09/17/10 06:02 PM)
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#138948 - 09/17/10 06:20 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: phat]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
I've looked seriously at the possibility of a combination alcohol/wood stove, (the Caldera Cone folks have one) but they are just too heavy. Like phat, if I want a fire and it's legal (not very often where I backpack), I'll just build a small fire in an already existing fire ring.

Out here in the west, in areas close to and above timberline and also in more popular areas, fires are usually banned. Mostly it's because of the scarcity of fuel. The land managers want what little dead wood exists in those areas to decay and replenish the extremely thin alpine soils. A wood stove would be no better than a campfire in this regard, since even small twigs are scarce. We also have seasonal bans--no fires even in the fireplaces in car campgrounds--during times of high fire danger, which usually happen during the "dry season" (July through September, although this year's September is quite wet).

In the East, where you rarely have dry seasons and wood is plentiful if not in too great a supply, it's a different story. I suspect that you'd save enough weight on fuel to offset the extra weight of a wood stove.
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#139045 - 09/20/10 07:14 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove/"FLAME wars [Re: CamperMom]
finallyME Offline
member

Registered: 09/24/07
Posts: 2710
Loc: Utah
Originally Posted By CamperMom
Hi, Guys-

If we start to debate the merits of 3-rock fire lays VS contained fires and protecting the plane, will we be in danger of starting a "FLAME WAR" here?

LOL!

CamperMom


Now that is funny, I don't care who you are. thanks
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#139048 - 09/20/10 07:29 PM Re: Making my own wood gassifier stove [Re: phat]
finallyME Offline
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Registered: 09/24/07
Posts: 2710
Loc: Utah
I agree with phat. And, it took a little while to come to this conclusion. I am an engineer by profession. I think the bushbuddy is freakin' cool. I think the whole concept of a gassifier is awesome. I had to have one. Of course, I couldn't find the money to buy one, and I love to make stuff, so I decided to make my own. I did and it worked great. But then came the thinking on how to make it lighter. Which led to what is the purpose of the stove. To me, the purpose for choosing this stove over others was that you didn't have to carry fuel. And it is better than a can because it burns the fuel more efficiently. Why is it important to burn wood more efficiently when you don't have to carry it? That led to why not just bring a can? A can does the same thing, just less efficient, but cheaper and lighter. And then, why bring a can when a small fire with rocks will do the same thing but be free and weigh nothing? I have never gone anywhere in Utah that didn't allow fires some of the year. If you are concerned about hurting the ground, then bring a piece of sheet metal. Also a trick I learned from earthling is to use two SS bicycle tire spokes to support your cup. I still like wood burning stoves, and think they have their place. But I have a hard time justifying them on a backpacking trip. But, YMMV.
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