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#135559 - 06/27/10 05:44 PM Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter?
rustyb Offline
newbie

Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 9
I need a rugged and reliable filter for use in silty water. How does the Pocket do in this realm, or more specifically, once the silt slows it down, how much of its original performance can be restored and how easily is this done?

Also, how much force does it require to pump compared to the Hiker Pro and Sweetwater Guardian? Any other comparisons between the Pocket and the aforementioned would be appreciated.

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#135634 - 06/29/10 12:34 AM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
balzaccom Online   content
member

Registered: 04/06/09
Posts: 2232
Loc: Napa, CA
We ues the Hiker Pro and like it a lot. They've just upgraded the filters so that you also get a washable screen that should take out most of the crud before it clogs your filter.
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#135640 - 06/29/10 07:15 AM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
Glenn Offline
member

Registered: 03/08/06
Posts: 2617
Loc: Ohio
No, I've not used it. Are you interested in any other filters?

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#135648 - 06/29/10 10:07 AM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: balzaccom]
rustyb Offline
newbie

Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 9
I have a Hiker Pro as does my buddy. In the water we filter, they last four days before they're practically ready for the trash bin. The washable screen does nothing in our environment. My buddy also dropped his and cracked the nifty quick release inlet which, renders the pump useless...unless you hold the filter under water while pumping.

Otherwise, I really like this filter....the ease of set-up, its simplicity and light weightedness. Just doesn't work where I go. Thanks though.

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#135649 - 06/29/10 10:21 AM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: Glenn]
rustyb Offline
newbie

Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 9
Besides the Katadyn Pocket, I have not seen a filter out there that looks robust to me. Have owned or used the Sweetwater Gaurdian, First Need, Hiker Pro, MSR Miniworks (in clear water), MSR Hyperflow and another older Katadyn I forget the name of. The latter did good but it's been a long time. I don't think it was the Pocket unless Katadyn used iodine at one time in that model. At any rate, the others just don't work well where I go (though I hear the Miniworks does well in silty water). The Sweetwater has worked ok for me but I have had issues with their filter cartridges and pump shafts breaking.

From what I have seen (only the filter cartridge in person) and read on the Katadyn site, the Pocket filter has the robustness and simplicity I'm looking for. However, before I plop down almost $300, I want to make sure its performance can be restored to a large degree in the field.

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#135652 - 06/29/10 10:57 AM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
I think I am not understanding what you mean by "robust."

Are you meaning it will filter anything? If you are filtering very muddy water, you can always pretreat it with a flocculant to settle out the particulates. Prefilters help a lot too.

If you mean unbreakable... I have yet to see a filter that is not breakable - the Pocket is no exception. All of them have plastic housing after all. I'd have to say the filter least likely to break is my gravity filter - a bag made of waterproof nylon with a filter inside it. I can take the filter out and use it for a shower, too.
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

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#135654 - 06/29/10 11:49 AM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: lori]
rustyb Offline
newbie

Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 9
By robust, I mean something that isn't likely to break if accidentally dropped or break during operation. Does the Pocket have a plastic housing? I could be wrong but I thought it was aluminum.

We often times let the water settle overnight and I have used the old Sweetwater prefilters. Both help with my MRS/Sweetwater Gaurdian but the Hiker Pro still pooped out after 4 days.

I can see where the gravity filter systems would work well for some. However, most of the time, we filter when taking a quick potty break or when scouting and/or portaging (kayaking) so don't have time to set up a gravity system and wait. To save weight, we carry minimal water (27 oz) and filter as we need.

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#135658 - 06/29/10 12:34 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
I think it's funny when people think it involves waiting... I'm usually done filtering before other people are done pumping. But to each his own.

You could always go with a Sawyer inline filter if speed is the need - splice it into the hose of the hydration bladder. Then you can fill the bladder with water straight from the source and drink through the filter. They weigh 3 oz, you could take two or three filters and swap if one clogs and you don't want to stop to backflush it.
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

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#135659 - 06/29/10 12:44 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: lori]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
I agree with Lori. It takes me less than 2 minutes to filter a quart with my ULA Amigo Pro, once the water is in the bag. I certainly can't pump that fast, especially since the pumping tends to put my back out!

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May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#135663 - 06/29/10 12:57 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: OregonMouse]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
I think the problem is perception - since you aren't actively doing anything to get the water in the bladder, just standing there waiting, it seems a lot longer. Which is why I like the gravity filter - I can do something else while I'm filtering, like peel off my socks and air off the sweaty feet, or eat a snack, or reapply sunblock....
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

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#135665 - 06/29/10 01:00 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: lori]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
Or watch the scenery or snuggle up with my perpetually-shedding dog!
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#135667 - 06/29/10 01:18 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: OregonMouse]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
I guess I also have a unique perspective, hiking with a huge group of people. When I started out a few years ago I was the only one with a gravity filter - the ULA Amigo Pro. I got a lot of raised eyebrows with it. Everyone thought it was going to be slow. All the other hikers were busily getting down with the Sweetwaters, Hiker Pros, Varios and whatnot (never a Pocket, tho) - there were also the handful of holdouts with that good ol' First Need. I noticed a lot of times I was sitting and waiting for them after filtering. Lots of swearing when they dropped something in the water or broke a handle.

Now when the group goes backpacking, I see three or four gravity filters every time - Platy Cleanstreams and Katadyn Base Camps. All of them use the glass fiber type filter with activated charcoal in, like the Amigo Pro. Not a lot of difference in flow rate between them. I guess people really do need to see things to believe them.
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

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#135669 - 06/29/10 01:42 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: lori]
rustyb Offline
newbie

Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 9
Ok, in terms of time, what's involved in setting a gravity filter up? Also, have you used yours in silty dirty desert water?

Carrying a few spares to replace clogged filters seems reasonable....if that's all it took. However, I'd be surprised if that's all it would take considering the surface area of the Hiker Pro and the fact it clogs so quickly.

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#135673 - 06/29/10 03:08 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
There's no setup time at all for my gravity filter. It came fully assembled and stays that way. You take it out of whatever bag you carry it in (ziplock for me), fill the "bucket," hang the carrier loops over a branch, attach your Platy to the hose (if you still have one of those filter connectors that Platypus no longer makes), open the hose, sit down and eat a snack. You do have to "burp" the air out of the Platy bottle once or twice during the filling process.

I've never had any problems with the filter clogging. Admittedly, I would never try to use any filter in water that's full of glacial or any other kind of silt. I have used "partly cloudy" water in times of meltoff or rainy weather, though. About once a week I remove the prefilter covering of the Hiker Pro filter and rinse it off.

Since my ULA Amigo Pro bag sprang a leak and they're not making them any more, I have put together my own gravity filter using a Sea-to-Summit Ultrasil dry bag, a Hiker Pro replacement filter and parts from US Plastics. It's an ounce lighter than the Amigo Pro, which was 7.5 oz.

_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#135675 - 06/29/10 05:10 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
Glenn Offline
member

Registered: 03/08/06
Posts: 2617
Loc: Ohio
Although I'm now playing with the Hyperflow (jury's still out), I've used the MSR Miniworks very happily for, what, 10 years? I've never had it break, and have only been through one cartridge. I've filtered some pretty murky water, with leaves and silt - but I've also often used a pot to dip the water and let it settle for a minute or two, just to make things a little less hectic. It's easy to clean in the field, too. (Hold the outlet up, instead of down, and you can use dirty water to rinse it - I think they recommend clean water for cleaning the element simply because of the chance that you might contaminate the outlet.)

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#135679 - 06/29/10 06:42 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
Setup? Pull it out of the bag. Done.

Silt? Let's see... I've had to let the water settle for a while at times. I think if I were going anywhere where the water is full of silt and mud to the degree that a clog is a guarantee, I'd take a fold up bucket (I've seen people use a gallon milk jug with the top cut off, carried over the end of a sleeping pad, for a bucket) and add flocculant to settle out the sediments BEFORE filtering it, regardless of the type of filter I took. It would take as long as it has to take... but the water would be clean and drinkable at the end. I do not know of a backpacking filter that would not clog if you overwhelm it with water from the Colorado River at high flow or in desert mudholes... There are limits to everything.

There are degrees of silt - the Amigo Pro has a bit of tube in the bottom and when full the filter sits up off the bottom of the bag. So letting it sit for a while before starting to filter might help in some cases, but certainly not all. It's worked well with the little bit of sediment I've encountered.

Very late in season or when going anywhere I know there will be small puddles, I still take the Hiker Pro, which uses the same cartridge as the Amigo Pro. Most of the time I take the Amigo Pro. I definitely am not a desert person, too much heat turns me into a zombie, but I do go into low elevation parks at times that were formerly ranches, where water sources can be... iffy. If you are wanting something that will handle water that's beyond iffy, I don't know that any backpacking filter by itself would be up to the task. There has been water that I both filtered AND threw in Micropur and waited well over an hour before even trying to drink it.
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

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#135686 - 06/29/10 08:05 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: lori]
rustyb Offline
newbie

Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 9
Thanks for the input. After our experiences with the Hiker Pro, I'll be selling mine and certainly wouldn't try anything that uses the same filter cartridge. I purchased because of its convenience...that and everyone said it was the cats meow. Might be for many but not where I use it. Too bad I didn't see until after purchasing but I now see that Katadyn states it is "for clear and slightly turbid water". However, Katadyn states their Pocket filter is "for extremely turbid water" hence my reason for asking about it....that and it looks/sounds like a robust filter that will reliably work for years.

As far as letting the silt settle, yes, we did with the Hiker Pro....at least once to camp. We'd let it settle overnight. With my MSR/Sweetwater Gaurdian, I got to the point that I wouldn't even let the water settle. Once it started to get difficult to pump, I'd just brush out the cartridge in the field. Wouldn't restore it fully but it wasn't bad...and I'd replace the cartridge about every 8 trips even though it was still going. However, since 96, I've had two of the filters break and one pump shaft.

Though I find the gravity system intriguing, until I hear of one that has been proven to work in very silty conditions (field cleaning is expected), I'll continue to pursue the Katadyn Pocket.


Edited by rustyb (06/29/10 08:14 PM)
Edit Reason: clarification

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#135688 - 06/29/10 08:29 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
Glenn Offline
member

Registered: 03/08/06
Posts: 2617
Loc: Ohio
I've been tempted to try the Pocket Filter a couple of times, but the price tag dissuaded me.

You might consider buying the Pocket from REI, with their no-questions-asked return policy in case it doesn't work. (Double check with them first, to make sure there aren't any catches.)

If you do get a Pocket, let us all know how it works.

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#135689 - 06/29/10 08:44 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
FYI, the Vario is also intended for turbid water.

http://www.backpackgeartest.org/reviews/...Ray%20Estrella/

And unlike the pocket I have used it. I doubt it would break as easily as the MSR plastic handles.

And as I said... every single filter has its limits. Why I kept bringing up the flocculant.

The ULA filter is no longer made, so any gravity filter you find will be MSR, Katadyn or Platypus - or Sawyer. I just saw a 4 liter Sawyer system in REI today. I have pondered getting the Sawyer purifier (same size and about the same weight as the filter, rated to 10,000 gallons) as a replacement when the hiker pro filter in the ULA dies - just splice the purifier into the Amigo Pro's hose.
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

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#135703 - 06/30/10 05:51 AM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
ringtail Offline
member

Registered: 08/22/02
Posts: 2296
Loc: Colorado Rockies
I hiked the Wonderland with a guy that has a Pocket Filter. We ran short of water once and filtered water that has so much glacial flour that it looked like chocolate milk. We got about a quart before it clogged. He scrubbed the element then filtered more. Pretty tedious to filter, scrub, filter.

Filters do not take the color out of the dark tannin water, but it is safe to drink.

Most of the time I carry AquaMira. In Colorado there are some areas with grazing, then I use chemicals and a gravity filter. In the Grand Canyon I use chemicals on the side stream water. I use UV to treat Colorado River water. I use a Katadyn Hiker filter for "salad" water from pot holes that contain a lot of suspended organic matter.

There is a best way for different situations, but not all water is created equal.

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"In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not."
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#135706 - 06/30/10 11:17 AM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
BarryP Offline
member

Registered: 03/04/04
Posts: 1574
Loc: Eastern Idaho
“By robust, I mean something that isn't likely to break if accidentally dropped or break during operation.”
And
“Have owned or used the Sweetwater Gaurdian, First Need, Hiker Pro, MSR Miniworks (in clear water), MSR Hyperflow and another older Katadyn I forget the name of.”

If you have tried all those, I don’t think anything will please you.
If you drop any filter cartridge on a rock, it has a great possibility of breaking. But how do you know if it broke? You don’t. It still performs the same. The First Need however, makes brown water clear unless it’s broke; then the water is brown.

I’m willing to carry the 16oz filter for its nice pre-filter, speed, anti-air bubble, minimal part design (thus lower maintenance) and pesticide (etc.,) cleaning.
I just wish there was something that filtered tannic water (to produce clear water) that was lighter than the First Need.

“After our experiences with the Hiker Pro, I'll be selling mine and certainly wouldn't try anything that uses the same filter cartridge.”

That’s what all our scouts say too. We have scouts that are excellent with the nature of Shire Tarptents but fail with the Hiker Pro. In other troops, the Hiker Pro might be scout proof. Maybe it’s the pond and lake water we use. And that’s another reason our troop now uses First Need the most. And the cartridges are built like cannon balls--- so that helps with scouts.

-Barry, who psychologically can’t drink clean brown water (yet)

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#135709 - 06/30/10 12:13 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: BarryP]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
Another worry about filters - freezing damages a filter that hasn't been dried out thoroughly, and there's no way to dry one out while using it on the trail. I've slept with the gravity filter in my footbox to keep it from freezing, but lately have taken to leaving it full of water instead, since it takes a real long sustained low 20s night to freeze even the surface of water hard, and a gallon and a half of water will stay liquid in usual 3 season cold snaps at elevation. Still have to keep the Hiker Pro in a ziploc in the footbox to avoid those microscopic cracks in the glass fibers.

I think what he wants is what everyone wants - the perfect filter. I'd also like one to remove pesticides in addition to never clogging. Also those chemicals that leech into water sources from old mines. I usually settle for being as informed as possible about water sources and choosing carefully.

So far as breakage... I am a klutz. I use alcohol stoves a lot because I tend to wreck small moving parts in a heartbeat, and a supercat stove is easy to replace. I have the Hiker Pro because it seems the most simple in terms of moving parts, and the more durable of the less expensive filters... have yet to see the housing so much as chip. But I try to be extra cautious with things that may have direct impact on survival or health.
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

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#135711 - 06/30/10 12:28 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: BarryP]
rustyb Offline
newbie

Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 9
Thanks, Barry.

When I spoke of breaking, I was referring to things like the quick connect inlet on the Hiker Pro and a broken pump on the Sweetwater. I have had at least one Sweetwater filter cartridge break too. How do I know? Well, when I happened to look down in my Klean Kanteen, my filtered water looked the same as the dirty water I just filtered from. No mistaken. Dropped hard? No. I have heard similar reports from others.

From what I have seen and read, the Katadyn Pocket is in a different league than the others I spoke of. The fact that it's alum and stainless steel coupled with a 20 yr warranty says something. Do the others have any of that? No. Not even close. Its sheer simplicity is different too. So yes, I think the Katadyn Pocket has the potential to work for me. If only it wasn't so much money....

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#135713 - 06/30/10 12:34 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: lori]
rustyb Offline
newbie

Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 9
Thanks, Lori. If you look at the Katadyn site though, the Vario is stated to be for "clear and slightly turbid water", just like the fabled Hiker. I have looked at the Vario closely too and it has way too many moving parts and gizmos for my liking.


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#136084 - 07/11/10 11:35 PM Re: Anyone use a Katadyn Pocket filter? [Re: rustyb]
Heather-ak Offline
member

Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 597
Loc: Fairbanks, AK
We bought one this summer. So far it has been on one overnight in the Alpine (Fairbanks, AK) and we used it in the Narrows in Zion National Park. It meets our needs because you need somewhere to hang those gravity feeds, and well living in Alaska, trees aren't where we hike (alpine.) I haven't used it in heavily silted areas - just rivers and streams. It seems very solid and easy to use. Though I am now using the filter attachment on the water bags, trying to pump, keep the bag upright and the bite valve out of the water was just too much.

Though it was the right decision for us, it definitely gives your arms a workout!

Heather
Fairbanks, AK

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