This may be an old topic but I can't find any info about it in search.
I purchased a 230g can of Counter Assault Bear Deterrent today at REI. It has a range of up to 30ft but at almost 12 oz, it just seems a little too much for something I will probably and hopefully never use. I've seen smaller cans of pepper spray elsewhere and my question to everyone is, what type and size does everyone here carry and recommend?????????? Thanks

http://www.rei.com/product/623173

I use the one you bought. As far as I'm concerned, if I ever have to actually use it, more is better. I don't count ounces however, so the weight and size aren't an issue to me. You can find smaller cans out there, though I've only ever purchases one can of spray and that was years ago and I haven't paid much attention since then.

I don't carry any at all, but I am usually just out in winter, so it doesn't matter that much. Counter Assault is the one spray I see recommended. Anything else may do nothing more than make the bear really mad at you. Not exactly what you want.

Read this-
http://www.centerforwildlifeinformation.org/BeBearAware/BearSpray/bearspray.html
and this-
http://tinyurl.com/cnetoh

I carry a full size bear version.. not a little "people" version.

Thankyou Tom for directing me to those Very informative article's as well as the video that should probably be shown or even included with every purchase.

The Service supports the pepper spray policy of the Interagency Grizzly Bear Committee, which
states that bear spray is not a substitute for following proper bear avoidance safety techniques, and that bear
spray should be used as a deterrent only in an aggressive or attacking confrontation with a bear.
Like seatbelts, bear spray saves lives. But just as seatbelts don’t make driving off a bridge safe, bear spray
is not a shield against deliberately seeking out or attracting a grizzly bear. No deterrent is 100% effective,
but compared to all others, including firearms, proper use of bear spray has proven to be the best method for
fending off threatening and attacking bears, and for preventing injury to the person and animal involved.

When it comes to bear spray, size does matter. One of the most important features when assessing sprays is the amount of spray contained in the canister. This shows up in two measurements; the weight of the canister (or net weight) and the the time of spray, i.e., how long does it last.

Counter Assault, one of the two or three sprays that one should consider IMO, puts out two sizes. A reason for the larger size? What if you run into the bear again? Or his buddy downstream? It's probably valid logic that, the denser the bear population and/or the deeper you are into bear country (# of days from trailhead), the larger the quantity of spray that should be carried.

This is one of the best times of year to buy Counter Assault. For the last few years, REI has put it on steep discount during the May membership sale.

FB

Don't quote me on this, but I think that's the minimal size that can be legally sold as "bear spray". From what I know, you're supposed to use an entire can during one spray, too. You wouldn't want to be shy about hosing a big bruin in the face.

Compared to other forms of protection (big guns, electric fences), that's pretty lightweight insurance. It's probably the best option for most people. I've not direct experience with bear spray, but all of the studies and anecdotal evidence I've heard have been very positive.

The only negative thing I've heard about it is that it can attract bears to the area after the can's been used, even the bear that got sprayed. This might be a myth; dunno. If spray gets used (on purpose or otherwise), it'd be a good idea to stash the can in a odor proof sack along with your food & toiletries.

I recommend......no bear spray at all. IMHO the potential danger does not justify the weight/expense. And that's assuming you can even access and deploy it in an effective manner.

Simply carrying the spray is only a part of the equation. Training and practice is the other. Read this quote from a spray manufacturer's own website:

"Bear attacks happen as fast as lightning!!! Most situations where you will need to use your UDAP Bear Spray will be in a close surprise encounter. Practice, at least seven times going for your spray, or until you can reach it in a split second’s time when needed. You may want to practice actually shooting from your holster with one of our inert cans. These cans have the same spraying power as our regular sprays without the hot pepper. For training purposes only, inert cans be purchased at half the price of our regular spray, we suggest also using outdated cans for this purpose. In a bear attack situation, we do know this: you will panic if you have not been trained ahead how you will think and react. Practice what you need to do in different attack situations. Rehearse, with friends or family various situations in order to be prepared in a real life threatening situation."

Numbers I would love to see: The number of people actually attacked by bears but saved from injury or death directly and solely by bear spray, versus the number of people who carry bear spray and never use it.

Of course I may think differently if I were to frequent grizz country on regular basis.

Hi, Trailrunner.

Last year a group of bear researchers published a study on the "Efficacy of Bear Deterrent Spray in Alaska" that looked at the question you asked. It appeared in the Journal of Wildlife Management. You can find the abstract online. Basically, when they reviewed 72 incidents between people and bears in which spray was used (most of them involving brown bears), they found that spray worked in the 90th percentiles. Some instances were charges, others were bears being hazed from food or garbage. (It didn't look at how many people carried and didn't use it...hmmm...that would be pretty hard to determine, I'd think.)

The lead researcher, Tom Smith, has done a lot of research on bear attacks in Alaska and on bear spray in particular. You can find some of his work at this site, including an FAQ on bear spray:

Alaska Bear Research Center

Yes, a good reason to carry the larger can despite the weight is that you might need all of it or you might need to use it more than once. In the study, several bears returned more than once when food was involved.

Wearing it in a holster on your belt makes it easy to access when you need it, rather than fumbling for it in your pack or elsewhere. ( I know this from nerve-racking experience.) It's pretty easy to flip the safety off; you can even aim it from the holster. Sometimes the sound and the cloud are what scare bears away--I know someone that happened with. It's also designed so you don't have to aim it specifically, just in their direction.

EPA recommends four brands in particular, which you can also Google.

And it's true that bears are attracted to capsicum if it's sprayed as "repellent" on objects or even on the ground (for the same reason we like Tabasco). It's not a good idea to test the can in the backcountry for that reason.

Absolutely I agree that whether it makes sense to carry it depends on where you live and what you think the risks are. To be honest, I take it on road trips, too, for the predators I'm most worried about.

FWIW, I never go hiking without it. It adds that extra margin of safety, and it can save bears from being destroyed if they're involved in a mauling that could have been avoided with a deterrent or common sense. I live in Alaska, and situations like that happen all the time.

Sorry for the long post. Cheers!

Ahhh...the equation is incomplete. One of the variables is missing!

Bear spray also protects the bear.

Many if not most 'aggressive encounters' are surprise ones. That is, the hiker and the bear come into sudden and unintentional close contact. Sometimes it's a turn in the trail, sometimes it's stumbling upon a food cache, often it's a cub on one side and mama on the other. The point, here, is that the encounters aren't the result of an intentionally aggressive bear...seldom are the encounters the result of predatory actions (talking griz and black bear here).

None the less, very often when a bear mauls a hiker that bear faces two alternatives; relocation or euthanization. Not always...but it's common. If bear spray can deter an attack to the point where the hiker is unharmed that bear has a much better chance to live another day.

Bear spray works. Bear spray has prevented potential human injury. Bear spray can spare the life of the bear.

Not bad for 12+ oz.

Just remember the bear spray is used on the bear! I was talking to a clerk at a local backpacking store and someone came in there and purchased the bear spray... and then proceeded to spray it all over themselves (Like Off! Bug spray). They swelled up and had to be hospitalized. Luckily they did it at the trailhead.

Great story!! Bears are very intelligent creatures. The same can't be said for all backpackers.

FB

How many wrecks were you in before you started carrying vehicle insurance?

you don't wait until after a catastrophe to prepare for it

Sorry, but the vehicle insurance example doesn't compare with bear spray. Bear spray is meant as a deterrent to prevent or lesson an attack. Vehicle insurance is meant to lower the expense AFTER the accident. It doesn't matter how much insurance coverage you have, it won't prevent the accident.
Notice that I am not saying for or against here, just that we need to compare apples to apples.

my point was that both events (bear attack, car wreck) are catastrophic, and taking steps to mitigate the damage is important.

perhaps a better analogy would be bear attack and carry bear spray vs car wreck, and buckling your seat belt?

Most of my hikes are into black bear territory in the Sierras. I don't carry bear spray. I really don't see a reason. The bears in California are more interested in getting your food and rarely are aggressive. The canisters are actually classified as a weapon and illegal to carry in national parks, though you would likely not see this restriction being enforced... I day hike in Yosemite nearly every weekend (and SEKI every other weekend) and see people carrying canisters the size of fire hydrants. None of them have used them, and none of them could use them - why stuff a bear can in the top side pocket of a tall pack out of your reach? The bear could be gnawing your leg off in the time it takes to get it off the top of your pack bag. Might as well not have it at all.

The very few bears I see on the trail will walk away from you. The bears you see in other wilder regions will run, like the wind. There have been more deer related injuries than bear attacks. I usually ask if people carry bear spray, why aren't they carrying a parachute, because the most frequent cause of death in Yosemite specifically are falls from high places...

I would probably carry bear spray in Wyoming, Montana, or any other region, however. Black bears are not grizzlies.

Agreed. Black bears will almost never attack humans unless you get between a mother and its cubs. Brown bears are much more easily provoked and may attack a person for their food or to defend territory. The most dangerous bears (I believe) are polar bears and I doubt bear spray would stop them. If you're hiking in very public areas (like the most visited sections of Yosemite) I would leave it at home. If you are in a more wilderness area where brown bears live, take it if it will make you feel safer... sometimes that feeling is worth it. People often don't need a belay when rock climbing... but it definitely makes that 200+ foot drop seem less imposing.

A law is probably going to be signed soon that will allow concealed weapons (with permit) to be carried in National Parks. I think this is a great law, because a firearm will definitely detour a bear (if used correctly). Not only that, but a great danger in many national parks is other people... especially around where I live (Northern California) with pot growers.

Weapons need to be concealed from bears?

I've been doing alot of hiking in bear territory this summer. So far I've seen a sow with 2 cubs, a set of juvie triplets, and a boar, all blackies. This is in the same area where there were 2 brownie maulings last summer (the trail where those maulings occurred has been closed). If I were by myself I'd carry bear spray, but my hiking partner carries an (unconcealed) .44 instead. We're hyper aware of all motion and sound (cow moose with new calves are also a big threat if you stumble on one) and have been scared by more than one black dog running up from behind us off-leash. There are an estimated 200-300 black bears living in the Anchorage bowl area, and probably several dozen brown bears. We know they are out there, probably closer than you'd ever know, so our #1 defense is awareness. Urban bears tend not to be startled by humans - our experience so far has been to have them flat out ignore us and go on their merry way (rather than dash off like bears who are unaccustomed to humans). Anyway, it certainly adds a new dimension to hiking, but it doesn't stop us.

MNS

P.S. We've also seen coyote (it was either that or a wolf, I'm not sure I really know how ot tell the difference) and lots of eagles.

There have been several black bear maulings in AK, and AFAIK they were not "self defense" attacks. Bears tend to get grumpy when they are hungry (which is what seems to have happened last year with the maulings we had), and as far as I'm concerned a bear is a bear is a bear.

MNS

I have been reading the posts about mountain lions and this one and a few others that tie into these. I love statistics and odds. They put every situation in clear, concise language that everyone can understand. If I start down a trail and 7589 people just exited that trail unscathed, well I guess I am about to become one of the unlucky few. These scales are obviously all encompassing and unbalanced. Take any wilderness accident situation, be it animal, fall, lost, broken bones, hypothermia, whatever. Now if we remove all of you, who are obviously very knowledgable with considerable experience, from the equation, the danger needle shifts dramatically and 1 out of every 50 backcountry hiker will die. ( statistically speaking ). In the same sense if we ban all teenagers and people over 75 from driving, the highway would be a dramatically safer place ( statistically speaking ). ok ok my point is I believe everything is a 50/50 proposition. 50 percent you and 50 percent unknown. What you do with your half can push the danger needle in either direction. As for me, and to get back on subject, when I go to Yellowstone next year I will be carrying 2 cans of bear spray. If Lori can tell me where to get one as big as a fire hydrant, I will carry that as a spare. I have pulled lint out of my bellybutton that weighed more than a can of bear spray. I just don't see the problem. But then I am totally without any experience.

Your odds of being hurt are the same as anyone else's. It's not like there's some wilderness lottery where you all draw straws and the 5,483,238 customer gets mauled by a bear. It's more like, you flip a coin, 50-50 chance of heads or tails, the next guy flips a coin, he also has a 50-50 chance. You have a very remote chance of being mauled by a bear who's having a bad hair day. So do I. I have a remote chance of having my car vandalized at the trailhead; so do you. There is a far better chance that the car will be vandalized than of a bear deciding to chew on me, however, the property damage is preferable to the hospital stay. So I completely understand your dilemma...

To really and truly decrease your odds of being bitten by a bear, make sure you carry those bear sprays in your hands like drawn guns, the entire time you are out there. They will do nothing for you in a pack pocket and a holster when your adrenalin is sky high will be nearly as difficult. Be very careful to look the bear in the eye before you fire; shooting at a rustle in the bushes may result in a SAR to the nearest hospital for your hiking buddy.

I'd be more afraid of moose than bears.

Coyotes are small and thin, usually scrawny, rough coated. Wolves are tall, bulky, furry - like a malamute or husky but rangy/long legged - more predatory, and probably less afraid of you than coyotes. Wolves can be black, gray, brown or red, and any shade in between depending on subspecies; most coyotes are gray/dun.

I do not believe the odds of getting hurt are the same for everyone. I realize the dangers are the same. The odds of someone like me, a greenhorn, getting lost,mauled,etc. are much greater than they are for someone with your experience. Therefore stats are basically worthless.

I am sure many of you know more about bears than I do. However, I would just like to clarify something. What we call “black bears” can also be brown or cinnamon in color. Grizzlies are brown but they are identified mostly by the hump on their backs. What I am saying is, just because a bear is brown don’t panic it isn’t necessarily a grizzly.

I have a can of bear spray that was given to me by a customer. I have never carried it for the reasons mentioned. It clips on a belt but seems quite heavy. I was told by a naturalist that bear spray is only effective 50% of the time. It is one of those things where one cannot know for sure what is best. There have been people attacked by black bears where I live but it isn’t all that common. We have bears walking into our fair city at this time of year.

Howie

one last personal thought on bear spray. Again, this is just a perspective from someone with zero experience.
Should I experience a bear encounter, will I even realize it before I am facedown on the trail wearing a bear rug?
Probably not...but just maybe.
If I do see the bear coming will I have time to get to my pepper spray before he gets me?
Probably not...but just maybe.
If he pulls up short, growling and snapping his teeth, thus giving me time to get the pepper spray out, and then he charges. Will I be competent and calm enough to spray him?
Probably not...but just maybe.
Should he just want to scare me and then run off, will my heart be able to slow down enough to avoid exploding?
Probably not...but just maybe.
Seems to me that just maybe is all I have. To each his own, but I intend to carry it. A little peace of mind goes a long way.