I have to lighten my load, and I'm starting with the two heaviest items: pack and tent. My last pack was a Mountain Hardwear Harrier, which, while nice, tipped the scales north of 6.5 lbs empty. Not a good way to start.
I'd like to get down to 3 lbs or less for the pack, and I see mostly rave reviews for the Vapor Trail. Any cons to this pack or is it the way to go when you want/need ~3600cu/in?
When going for lighter total weight, usually, the pack is the last thing to change. This is because your choice of pack depends on both total weight carried and volumn of gear. What kind of weight are you currently carrying? How can you easily reduce that weight? Leaving unneeded items at home is the best way to start. For instance, do you really need that change of clothes, three jackets, etc.. Then reduce the weight of each item. Switching from a hard Nalgene to a Gatorade bottle is virtually free and saves you about 4oz. After you have gone through these steps and know how much your total carry weight is and how much volumn you need, you can get a new pack that fits you and is designed to carry those specs with confidence that it will serve you well. As to the Vapor Trail, I'll let someone who has used it comment on the pack itself.
_________________________
If I wouldn't eat it at home, why would I want to eat it on the trail?
Oh, one more thing. Take a look at your current pack and see if you can lighten it. If the lid is removable, you have extra long straps that can be shortened, or other dodads that can be removed you may be able to lighten you current pack somewhat.
_________________________
If I wouldn't eat it at home, why would I want to eat it on the trail?
thanks, but that's the approach I'm taking. My pack plus tent was 12 pounds *alone*...pushing me to 36 lbs with food and water when all was said and done. Just way too much weight, and I learned a lot by dissecting what I need vs. what I don't.
I go out for 2-nighter weekend trips, and keep the clothing to a minimum...usually just an extra pair of socks, a shell, and my fleece (winter camping). I use a Platypus instead of Nalgenes, and my 3L hydration bag isn't filled more than 2L full for the hike. Two hiking buddies have water filters so I don't need to carry one, so I can fill the Playtpus for cooking when we cross water.
External pockets aren't terribly important, because honestly if I need something mid-hike, it's usually just an energy bar or two and I keep those in a jacket or pants pocket. Anything greater than that I'll probably need to take the pack off anyway, so I'd just assume keep them stored in the top of the pack.
Already returned it. Whenever I hung the pack by the top loop, which is attached to the bag, the frame would slip out of the bag under its own weight and it was a PITA to get it back in with any gear inside. Not a very good design, IMO.
36 minus 12 equals 24lbs. It sounds like you are doing the right things to get your clothing weight down so what are you carrying other than you tent and pack to get to 24 lbs? I am by no means UL and my carry weight with tent but without food, fuel, or water is under 20lbs.
_________________________
If I wouldn't eat it at home, why would I want to eat it on the trail?
This won't format well, but here's my data. Some items I carried were for multiple hikers, for instance the folding saw (11 oz) which I can't tell you how much it saved us last time since it rained a lot and we had to cut down a dead tree for firewood one night and cut up downed wood the next...then the meals for 2, etc.
Item / weight, lbs / weight, oz / notes fuel bottle / 1 / 4 / 80% full tent / 5 / 10 footprint / 0 / 10 stove / 0 / 9 folding saw / 0 / 11 pack cover / 0 / 4 trail guidebook/0 / 8 sleeping bag / 3 / 0 fleece / 1 / 7 flask / 0 / 8 inflatable seat/ 0 / 3 sleeping pad / 2 / 8 dinner / 1 / 6 /pasta dinner for 2 first aid kit/ 0 / 4 2L pot / 1 / 5 pot, folding spoon, xbowl breakfast / 0 / 13/ grits, maple syrup for 2 TNF shell / 1 / 12 pack top / 1 / 8/ granola bars, TP, matches, handwarmers, fire paste pack + water / 10 / 0/ 2L water bag
Leave the footprint at home. It is not necessary and adds 10oz to an already heavy tent.
Photocopy only the pages you need for the trail guide and save 5-6oz
Your fleece is heavy - My 200 pullover is only 14oz. Do you have a lighter weight one?
Your TNF jacket is heavy. I use a Marmot Preclip which weighs 13oz. Some folks like the FroggToggs which is a complete rain set for under $20 and weighs very little.
If you can do without the fire, leave the saw behind and save 11oz.
Your sleeping pad is heavy. I use a POE Ether6, an inflatable, insulated pad at 21oz. It costs around $70 or or $6 you can use a blue CCF pad from Walmart at less than half a lbs.
What kind of stove do you use and do you need all the fuel. A lightweight catridge stove weighs around 3oz plus the fuel canister and cost $30-$50. An alcohol stove weighs a few ounces and made at home is free.
Depending on how you go, that is over 4lbs weight savings for little cost.
Hope this helps.
_________________________
If I wouldn't eat it at home, why would I want to eat it on the trail?
I'm not sure what you're describing. On my Vapor Trail, the frame wasn't removable - it was sewn into the back pad. Did you have a defective model? (Or did they change it for 2009?)
Anyhow, I always liked the Vapor Trail for loads below 25 pounds; above that, I found it began to get uncomfortable for me (it may be that it's a fixed torso length, and the medium was a bit short, but the long was a bit long.) Anyhow, I used it happily for several years. Recently, I replaced it with an Osprey Aether 60, which I chose in response to some other changes in my gear and the types of trips I'm taking. (I backed off a step from ultralight.)
If you intend to lighten up a lot, the Vapor Trail should work for you. If you find you like the general design of the pack, but not the suspension, you might want to look at Granite Gear's Nimbus Ozone. If neither of those work, take a look at the 2009 Osprey Atmos and Exos series - the packs are in the 2-3 pound range, and made for light packing. (My Aether 60 weighs 4 pounds. Even with it, my summer weekend weight with food and a quart of water is 20 pounds; add winter clothing, and I'm at 23 pounds. Extra water adds up fast - and a lot of places I go lately require me to carry 2 or 3 quarts of water, so I can hit 25 or 30 pounds pretty quick - thus the Vapor Trail no longer made sense for me. But it's still a great pack in the right circumstances.)
#110205 - 01/27/0907:59 PMRe: any negatives to the GG Vapor Trail?
[Re: energy_turtle]
hikerduane
member
Registered: 02/23/03
Posts: 2124
Loc: Meadow Valley, CA
I like to use a ground cloth to save the tent bottom and when using my floorless Squall, it is the floor. Even Tyvek would weigh a little less than your footprint. Gossamer Gear has polycryon at around 3-4 oz. range. Keep it out of the sun.
Leave the footprint at home. It is not necessary and adds 10oz to an already heavy tent.
>>>already considering this, but a lighter tent is in my future anyway
Photocopy only the pages you need for the trail guide and save 5-6oz
>>>good plan, although I might not need it at all. fellow hiker intends to buy a handheld GPS
Your fleece is heavy - My 200 pullover is only 14oz. Do you have a lighter weight one?
Your TNF jacket is heavy. I use a Marmot Preclip which weighs 13oz. Some folks like the FroggToggs which is a complete rain set for under $20 and weighs very little.
>>>regarding the fleece and shell...they are heavy, but necessary on this past trip. Early January up in the GA section of the AT = humid cold. (for the record the fleece is the ubiquitous TNF Denali, which zips into the shell.) for much of the hike it was below freezing:
If you can do without the fire, leave the saw behind and save 11oz.
>>>see above
Your sleeping pad is heavy. I use a POE Ether6, an inflatable, insulated pad at 21oz. It costs around $70 or or $6 you can use a blue CCF pad from Walmart at less than half a lbs.
>>>I agree, and in hindsight it was a bad purchase. I may exercise the liberal return policy at REI for an inflatable or for the new thermarest neoair when it comes out if I can come to grips with the price tag.
What kind of stove do you use and do you need all the fuel. A lightweight catridge stove weighs around 3oz plus the fuel canister and cost $30-$50. An alcohol stove weighs a few ounces and made at home is free.
>>>on this I probably won't change. it's an MSR Simmerlite, which is light enough...but I intend to carry about half as much fuel next time.
Depending on how you go, that is over 4lbs weight savings for little cost.
For a Granite Gear pack, I think you can make your selection based on what your full load (food and water, plus gear) will be on your most aggressive expected conditions (for example, 4 nights on the AT in weather where temperatures won't drop below 20.) If that load is below 30 pounds, the Vapor Trail should work very well. You may find it will "only" be reasonably comfortable at the max rating, but will be great on the trips you mostly take: a weekend on the AT in weather above 50 degrees. If that load is 30 - 40 pounds, the Nimbus Ozone will be a better choice.
Granite Gear rates their packs by maximum carrying weight, and I found them to be very accurate on the Virga, Vapor Trail, and Nimbus Ozone.
Even though I no longer carry one, I still think Granite Gear makes excellent packs. (I am pleased with my Osprey Aether so far - though I hated the fit of the Osprey Atmos. My buddy loves his Atmos, though.)
#110217 - 01/27/0908:50 PMRe: any negatives to the GG Vapor Trail?
[Re: energy_turtle]
Trailrunner
member
Registered: 01/05/02
Posts: 1835
Loc: Los Angeles
I've used a Vapor Trail since spring of '06 and it has served me well. It's the most comfortable pack I have ever used. I also used it as the last 1/4 with a 3/4 length sleep pad. Not a good pack if bells and whistles are your thing, just a good, sturdy, light bag to put your stuff in.
_________________________ If you only travel on sunny days you will never reach your destination.*
* May not apply at certain latitudes in Canada and elsewhere.
#110221 - 01/27/0908:59 PMRe: any negatives to the GG Vapor Trail?
[Re: Trailrunner]
jasonklass
member
Registered: 08/27/05
Posts: 551
Loc: Denver, Colorado
The side pockets are virtually useless. Many people complain about this. Other than that, it seems to be a great pack. I almost got one but the bad design of the side pockets was a deal breaker for me.
Edited by jasonklass (01/27/0909:00 PM)
_________________________ Gear Talk There's no such thing as having too many sporks!
Sorry, I missed the fact that your last trip was January. What kind of temps did you have on the AT there. I had relatives in Macon and outside Knoxville, TN so I've spent time in that region in December/January but never done that part of the AT.
_________________________
If I wouldn't eat it at home, why would I want to eat it on the trail?
#110282 - 01/28/0903:08 PMRe: any negatives to the GG Vapor Trail?
[Re: jasonklass]
Trailrunner
member
Registered: 01/05/02
Posts: 1835
Loc: Los Angeles
Originally Posted By jasonklass
The side pockets are virtually useless.
Just a different perspective, but mine work quite well for me. I use them for a Nalgene or Gatorade water bottle. I can reach back and pull them out with the pack on but I have to loosen my straps a bit to get them back in.
We spent the Friday night car camping at the trailhead at Dicks Creek Gap, and that night got down to the high 30s, followed by a high of 45 Saturday around noon before the bad weather rolled in. We actually used a shelter Saturday night, which turned out to be a blessing because it got windy and rained off and on from 3pm onward, getting fairly heavy overnight. The shelter was 1100' higher than Dicks Creek Gap, and although we went to bed at 9pm and 45F weather, it dropped dramatically overnight. When we woke up at 6:30a Sunday morning it was 31-32F, and a fog layer thicker than I've ever seen squatted on the mountain. We were still having to use headlamps until almost 8am and there was no sign of the sun. Weirdest thing we'd ever seen. As we hiked back down ice was forming on our jackets from our breath.
Cold and damp, the worst kind. I'd rather have the -20F degree weather of MN where I live now than 30F and damp. You might find that a synthetic fill jacket would be warmer than for less weight. You may even be able to use a microfleece pullover and a something like a micropuff jacket for less total weight and more options than a single heavey fleece. A lighter rain jacket like the Preclip will definately still keep you dry and will breath better for less weight than your TNF. I still use my TNF for winter camping but I'm using a sled and weight matters less. Hope you had fun on this trip. As I've been reminded lately, there is no bad weather, just inappropriate clothing.
_________________________
If I wouldn't eat it at home, why would I want to eat it on the trail?
The side pockets are virtually useless. Many people complain about this. Other than that, it seems to be a great pack. I almost got one but the bad design of the side pockets was a deal breaker for me.
I have to agree with Trailrunner here. I like the side pockets rather than loose mesh because, in my experience, they help keep whatever's in the pocket (Platypus bottle most of the time) in place without any worry of it falling out. The incredible stretch of the Schoeller material and there durability help to protect the bottom sides of the pack. The compression from the stretch also helps to keep things against the pack allowing for the center of mass to be closer to the body.
I would agree that they are difficult to get into sometimes, especially when the pack is full, but because the materials and construction are bomber, I have no problem man handling the stuff into the pockets. Getting the stuff out isn't as big a deal as a lot of people make it, either. I can do it with the pack on, but admittedly I have to take it off to get the stuff back in. I have grown to really like these pockets and wish other pack manufacturers would follow suite.
_________________________
Believe, then you will Understand...
Registered: 01/26/04
Posts: 269
Loc: SF Bay Area, CA
I have been using the Vapor Trail since 2002. I wrote up a brief vapor trail review several years ago. I think the VT is a great pack up to 25-30lbs, 35 if you push it. I have tried numerous other packs, but the VT has been my go-to pack.
Negatives? For some, the lack of organizing features. The extension collar is too big which makes packing a bit more awkward than it should be, and there is no built in support for the load lifters... so if you don't pack carefully, you don't get the maximum support.
Positives? Most comfortable pack I have used for 10-25lbs, reasonably light weight, large enough for a bear canister, and a good volume for nearly all my trips.
Our long-time Sponsor, BackcountryGear.com - The leading source for ultralite/lightweight outdoor gear:
Affiliate Disclaimer: This forum is an affiliate of BackcountryGear.com, Amazon.com, R.E.I. and others. The product links herein are linked to their sites. If you follow these links to make a purchase, we may get a small commission. This is our only source of support for these forums. Thanks.!
Previous Topic
Index
