What size tent?

You all would cringe at the weight of the equipment we too with us on our first practice hike, but it was what we had and it was good for comparison purposes. My 16yo son and I took with us a 12-lb 3-person tent. The square footage was wonderful, the weight as not. We definitely need a new tent -- the question is what kind? We discussed the pros and cons of each and didn't come to a conclusion.

Individual tent: Pros - Lightest in weight at the individual level. My son wouldn't have to carry all the tent weight. It would be nice for him to have a personal tent if he were to go backpacking with friends and not family. Cons - Two tents to carry. And the biggie -- when we urban dwellers started hearing night noises and were convinced we were about to be carved into little bits, it was nice not to be alone.

2-person: Pro – Lighter weight to carry. Con – Cramped for mother and son and all equipment (keeping the stuff inside the tent is another question …). Probably cramped with just two adults and no stuff, also.

3-person: Pro – Plenty of room for two plus stuff. Con – Heaviest option although the new tent would be substantially lighter than the one we currently have.

I think we’re leaning toward a light 3-person tent, choosing to sacrifice weight for floor space. We liked being able to have room to play cards, read and sleep without being on top of each other. I can see that not being an issue for spouses or others for whom personal space isn’t a boundary, but for us … we don’t want to be shoe-horned in.

Are we off our rockers looking for a much lighter 3-person tent versus a 2-person or individual tents? What about individual tents that connect? Is the connector piece plus the two tents approximately the same weight as a 3-person tent?

Is your 16-yr old son going to still be backpacking with you when he is 18+? Are you always going to want to backpack with another person? Do you want to fit any gear inside? If so the 3-man tent is the choice. If you ever decide to solo, it is too heavy. There is no standard for what constitutes a 3-man tent. Look for the actual dimensions. Look at shoulder location width, sit-up location height and length. Some of the narrow 2-man tents are designed to sleep head-to-foot. I doubt this is what you want to do. There are some 2-man tents that are essentially the same dimensions as 3-man tents. LOTS of 2-man tents are really not much bigger than a solo tent. There are double-wall tents and single wall tents. Single wall tents are lighter, but you will have condensation on the inside roof. Also, do you need a 3-season tent or 4-season tent? Few people need 4-season tents. You may want to rent tents until you get it figured out.

Have you considered a tarp?

You should think seriously about using tarps a lot, either by themselves or in conjunction with a LIGHT one person, or at most a two person rig. I only sleep in the tent - all other activities occur outside.

The only critters that are likely to give you any problems are insects. When they are an issue, tents often may make more sense. You really only need a tent in bad (rain or snow) weather, when swarming insects are a nuisance, or perhaps when you are in a busy public campground which is not typically the case when backpacking.

You're making my head spin, Wandering Daisy!

No, I don't expect my son to backpack with me as an adult, but occasionally through college is probably realistic. By that time, his 10-years younger sister might be interested in joining me. Right now, I don't ever see myself backpacking alone. Of course, that could always change. I have not considered a tarp, but again right now with our huge degree of inexperience and "trust" in the great outdoors, the idea of a walled tent feels more secure. Thanks for all the input regarding what we need to consider!

You might look at three general tent lines: TarpTent, the MSR Carbon Reflex, and the Big Agnes Fly Creek or Copper Spur models. All are available in one, two, and three-person models. The Tarptent line generally will have more floor space for the same number of people; the other two lines are double-wall with all-mesh inners, which offers the best ventilation in really hot areas. The Tarptents are well-ventilated; the others are even better-ventilated, in my own opinion.

You'll have to go strictly by website statistics for TarpTent; no stores that I know of stock them. However, you can go to the stores, crawl into the MSR and Big Agnes tents (as I said in the other thread, if they won't let you do this, you're in the wrong store), and use their "feel" to judge how the TarpTents will work. (You can compare stats for all three on their websites.)

These won't be the cheapest tents out there, but they will all be in the 4 - 5 pound weight range - which doesn't rule out a 3-person tent on a solo backpack.

I just got an REI Passage 2 tent. It's a two person tent and is fairly light at around 5 pounds. It's roomy as a solo tent which is what I got it for. If you and your son are not large people, I know you are not and your son is tall but if he is on the thin side this tent or similar would probably work. The length would be fine, the width is where you would need to decide. It's 54" wide. Maybe you can measure and mark off an area to see if that width would be suitable. The tent is inexpensive at $150. Just wanted to throw out a low priced option.

REI is having free shipping through the 3rd as well if there isn't near you.

I have no personal experience with REI tents, but from what I've seen in the stores and heard from friends who own them, they are great values, and function very well. The two-person versions are definitely worth a look, and the cost savings might allow you to get a solo tent and a two-person tent. (You could carry both tents on easy trips, storing gear and sharing cards and conversation in the larger tent, and each person having his own tent for sleeping.)

Kelty and Sierra Designs tents are also worth a look. However, in all three brands, you're probably going to find the 3-person versions too heavy for solo use. If you do end up with a 3-person tent, you can get two smaller stuff sacks and split the tent: one person carries fly and poles, the other carries the inner tent.

Like most other gear, you can choose only two of three features: light weight, low price, and good quality.

This seems like a pretty good 3p option. <$200, decent floor space and headroom, and it weight just over 5 pounds.

http://www.rei.com/product/833077/marmot-limelight-3p-tent-2011-closeout

It does look like a good value; I don't have any experience at all with Marmot tents (unlike the other brands I've mentioned), so I can't really comment intelligently about Marmot tents.

The lightest 3 person tent I am aware of is the MSR Carbon Reflex. But you will pay for it. It is a palace for two, tho.

I would look at that tent, the Tarptent 3 person tents, and at something like the 3 - 5 person 'mid tents (Golite Shangri La, MegaMid from Black Diamond, or other cottage gear 'mids) that have a bathtub floor/bugnet insert - these can be all season, light for the space you get, and you can leave the bugnet home when it's no longer bug season.

There are a lot of details you can consider in choosing a shelter, so it's no wonder your head might spin when suddenly confronted with so many variables. You seem already to have settled on the idea of a full-enclosure tent as opposed to a tarp setup. That's fine. It shows you know your mind.

Of all the considerations involved, I would name as the most important one the ability to cope with the worst weather you are likely to encounter. A shelter that fails to shelter you is a disaster. The pitfall here is choosing a tent that will withstand FAR MORE than the worst weather you will encounter. The most "bombproof" tents are not only heavy, but much more expensive.

The most common kinds of weather a tent might possibly need to cope with are wind, rain, & snow. Almost any decent quality tent can handle rain (but beware of cheap tents meant for backyard use). Snow only becomes a problem with heavy snow loads. Wind is the biggest variable. A good quality 3-season tent, correctly set up and staked out, will withstand wind gusts up to around 35 mph - which is a pretty heavy wind! 4-season tents are designed to stand up to much more than that.

As for the amount of space in a tent, everyone LOVES more space in a tent. It's a luxury! It comes at a price, though. The price is weight. Bigger tents weigh more. This forum emphasizes "packing light is more fun". That's why I'd counsel you not to get carried away with getting a spacious tent.

Tent makers like to designate tents as 1-person, 2-person, 3-person. This is only a very rough guide to a tent's size. Look at floor space, peak height (head space) and how vertical the walls are. These are your only true guide to how much space you'll have.

While cost is always a factor, try not to look at cost too much. Saving $30 or even $50 looks can look smart at first, but when you are 10 miles from the road it's the tent not the money that counts.

The most tempting thing to recommend to you is a single-walled tent, especially one of the TarpTent models designed by Henry Shires. They are excellent tents, and their space-to-weight ratio is also excellent. However, single-walled tents are a bit fussier, in that you need to know what they prefer in terms of where and how you pitch them. Put them somewhere that gets heavy dewfall and you may get a brief rain shower inside your tent when you bump it in the morning. It may be that your hiking areas will be dry desert and condensation won't be a factor at all.

Lastly, if you put in a few hours educating yourself and learning the basics of tents, and you are willing to spend a couple hundred dollars, the chances are good you'll be happy with whatever you get. There really are dozens of high-quality choices out there. With luck, you might get a great tent on closeout!

Good luck!

Here's a pretty encyclopedic overview of shelters. It should get you pretty well up to speed on what's available. It doesn't include a number of interesting models that came out in the past year (especially the Tarptent Stratospire 2, a double wall model that just came out), but it's still a good way to educate yourself on shelters.

I would frankly suggest borrowing or renting a tent to start with. This might give you a better idea of what you want--or don't want!

With any tent, you definitely want to set it up and put everyone inside before deciding if it's a keeper. Some two person tents are really too small for two people, and the 3-person version may be about right for two. Read carefully the specifications on the tent's website. With those in hand, you should be able to model the tent on your living room floor with masking tape and string. (Not my idea but Franco's--I've used his method several times, though, since he came up with the concept.)

Even a very good 4 season tent can be abused and demolished, if you don't know what you are doing. Encouraged by a nice experience with VE-25s on Denali, I ordered several for a backwoods archaeological project we were doing on Santa Rosa Island. I knew we needed tents that could stand up to high winds - about 60mph. I got one for each of us, which, sure enough, was luxurious - worthwhile when you are going to be living in one for a four month period. We never had to backpack them, but space and bulk were a consideration.

At our base camp, we focused on a central building and pitched our tents roundabout, in whatever setting appealed to each of us. One night I entered the building to start breakfast to encounter a crew member who had taken shelter there during the night. Her VE-25,pitched in an exposed spot to take advantage of the view, had been destroyed by a wind that sprang up about 10 PM. I, asleep in my tent,pitched in a willow thicket in a gully, never even heard the wind.

Those winds, known locally as "sundowners" can spring up from a dead calm in about ten or fifteen minutes.

On Denali, during one storm at 14,000 feet, we had to shovel off our VE-25 about every three hours, in a heavy snowstorm. Even good tents need care.

Here are a few things to think about.

1. Make your 16 year old son carry the whole tent. He can do it. Make him carry the stove and fuel as well. In fact, just make him carry all the "group" gear.

2. A 2 or 3 person tent can be broken down and split up among members who will use it. This generally results in a lighter tent load per person, as compared to a solo tent. Sometimes this can be accomplished by giving one person the poles and pegs, one person the fly, and the other the body. You can also distribute other items in the pack to come out even, if that is a concern.

3. He can use a 2 or 3 person tent to go with friends. In fact, he will probably prefer that over not sharing a tent with friends.

4. Make sure the tent has aluminum poles. Just sayin....

If the tent can't be split (example: a single wall tent), then one person carries the tent (figure a 3 lb. tent, 1.5 lbs per person) and the second person carries 1.5 lbs. of the first person's gear. There's more than one way to skin a cat even up the loads!

Just to reinforce finallyMe's warning, please don't buy a tent with fiberglass poles! They have a nasty habit of breaking under stress.