How much pack is too much pack?

We've probably covered this ground indirectly in other posts, but just for fun, let's kick around the question of whether you can carry too much pack.

Just to get things started, my basic load of summer gear, excluding the pack, is about 11 or 12 pounds. Adding a couple pounds of food, a quart of water, and a fuel canister brings me to about 15 or 16 for a summer weekend (add 2 pounds of winter clothes, and I'm at 17 or 18.) I could probably get by using something like the Granite Gear Virga, but I prefer my Deuter ACT Zero. It's two pounds heavier than a frameless pack, but it's very comfortable. The weight of that pack brings me to a load of 18 to 22 pounds, depending on season.

So, am I carrying too much pack? Should I ditch it for something lighter? Is it "wrong" to use a pack that is overkill for the loads you carry?

You're the one who carries it, so you get to decide. There's nothing "wrong" as long as you are happy with it!

I personally prefer to keep my pack (empty) under 2 lbs. yet I need it to have structure, including stays and load lifters. There are several packs around that meet those criteria, but I get along fine with my Six Moon Designs Comet (bought at the end of 2005, but still holding up just fine). It still feels as though it had been made especially for me. I found out back in 2009 that it will support more weight than I can comfortably carry. At 37 lbs. total pack weight, my shoulders, back and hips were just fine, but my knees and feet were screaming! But that's me, and I can't speak for anyone else! I can't even recommend my pack, since it was discontinued 7 years ago! The one comparable SMD Pack, the Starlite, is far too big in capacity for me--67 liters, while I need no more than 40 even for a 10-day trip.

Good point about capacity - there can be overkill there, as well as in the weight of the pack itself. I always liked Granite Gear packs, but eventually drifted away from them because they were just too big, even with the extension sleeve rolled all the way down. One of the things I like about my current pack is that it's 50 liters unextended, but has a nice extension cuff. I always found that too much capacity led to a "floppy" pack.

When I read a thread like this I'm reminded of of the Yukon pack ? ? ?

Mainly because its simply a pack built out of necessity to haul a load! < user b ware

The pack itself can be light by even rafts lightweight standards . But nothing makes it comfy.

Simply to much pack and not enough comfort!

For me it is in the teens for overnight and 20s for weekend trips.

Glenn, I've gradually dropped the weight of my gear so that even on very long hikes I'm rarely over about 17 or 18 pounds, and it all fits well in less than forty litres (though I rarely carry more than five or six days of food at a time).

I use a custom MLD burn that (on my back) carries exceptionally well. I actually had 26 pounds in it for a little over a day once and it still carried very well. The pack (with belt pockets) weighs just less than a pound (I took off some bungee cord and hardware I never used). It has no frame, but I wrap my neoair around the inside and it works fine, even at maximum load.

Best, jcp

I like big packs. They make packing way easier and give me the margin of error to add an unexpected item if needed (e.g. bear canister, large glass fish float found on the beach, 5 gallon bucket, firewood, an injured or sick person's gear, etc.

In making my own packs I have found that a large pack can be made that weighs very little more than a small pack. With a frame pack, for example, the frame, waist belt and shoulder straps are about the same for either pack. The volume of a bag can be doubled by only using about 50% more fabric and nylon fabric is very light. So the difference in weight between a large pack and small pack can be as little as an ounce or two.

My very large myog external frame pack, for example, weighs well under 1 pound.

I hate big packs.

I put all my gear in, and they sag and require lots of straps to compress the sack down to a not-floppy state.

And when I'm out with a pack of newbies, and they find that they packed too much and have stuff dangling off their packs, and start dragging and sighing that it's too hard, they're tired, etc. - some bright person notes that I have plenty of room in mine!

It's far too easy to put a cheesecake in a big gap in the pack! carefully packaged in something to keep it from being crushed, of course.

But in all seriousness, I believe in load balancing and minimizing bulk, because I have to ruck the thing all over the mountain, through tangles of trees and brush, and get it in a very small helicopter along with someone else, their pack, and maybe even their search dog, some of the time. And those are things I cannot do with a massive pack frame.

There are times you can get away with a pickup truck of a pack, and then there are times you want something smaller. I could not fit a huge pack inside my very light, solo tent for example, with room for me and the rest of the gear - and in Yosemite leaving the pack outside is an invitation to the pack stealing bears.

Clearly the solution is to have more than one pack - a pack for SAR, a load hauler when you need to lug the group's watermelons, an after six pack for formal occasions, etc.

There is a simple way for someone like myself to decide if you are carrying "too much pack".

1) Lift the pack, if you can.
2) Put it on, if you can.
3) Walk up the trail, if you can.

If you fail to complete any of these three actions, I would say you are carrying too much pack. Otherwise, it is a matter of personal judgement and I cannot make that judgement for you.

Just ran across a quantification of "how much pack" in Chris Townsend's Backpacker's Handbook (4th edition.) He gives a rule of thumb that your pack shouldn't exceed 10% of your total load.

Applying that to me, it yields about 2 pounds of pack - pretty much what my old Granite Gear Vapor Trail weighed, and it handled 25 pound loads very well. (I let it go, finally, because my gear volume shrunk enough that it was too large and became floppy - and because one of the accompaniments of aging is a slight loss of torso length, which meant the fixed suspension no longer fit.)

FWIW, I'm not looking to change packs; the one I have now is comfortable and just the right size (even if it is a pound too heavy by the above formula.) I just thought this might make an interesting discussion.

I can vouch for the fact that you can carry too much pack. I do it so I know it can be done.

I grew up in the days of big rucksacks so modern packs seem small to me visually. Luckily they are very light so carrying a bigger pack than I really need doesn't mean carrying a lot of extra weight. It also means I have room for a surprise cookie for each member of the party which usually goes over well.

I don't know where I ran across this one, but I've seen it suggested several times that the "Big 4" (pack, shelter, sleeping bag and pad) should be 50% of base pack weight (that means everything except food, water, fuel). Everything else (except food, fuel, water) should make up the other 50%.

I soon learned that my big problem in weight was not the "Big 4" but the "everything else"! Not only was it several pounds more than my "Big 4," but it was a lot harder to cut weight. Instead of saving a pound or two per item, it was half an ounce here and a tenth of an ounce there.

Depending on number of days, frequency of water sources, weather and how much you eat, the "consumables" of food, fuel and water could easily equal the base pack weight. Maybe more if you are traveling in the desert and hauling a couple of gallons.

Like all "rules," there's a considerable element of HYOH and YMMG (Hike Your Own Hike and Your Mileage May Vary)!

Being the gear head that you are, I had to take a look at the Deuter ACT Zero. That is a nice pack. I can see why you like it.

I'm still getting used to the Osprey 44. It's helped me more than anything to reduce bulk and pack tight. I'm still carrying more weight than you, but I'm pretty darn comfortable and lighter than I've ever been.

If you are comfortable and happy then you've done a good job. The actual pounds and ounces are numbers that don't matter nearly as much as happy

I pass out the "cookies" right before we leave. That way, the group is happy cuz they all got something from me, and I don't have to carry it.

I like to hold them in reserve and apply as appropriate. If everyone is grumpy after ten miles of mud a good cookie, somehow not crushed after days in the pack, can magically lift spirits.

On the other hand if everyone is making me grumpy then I just might apply all the cookies to myself.

Major thread drift here. Oh well...

With my kids(even now that they are "older"), I ALWAYS bring a couple of "secret" desserts along to pull out at strategic moments.

no
Jim

"Rules" like this one are really silly and miss the point... a heavy BUT comfortable pack will be far more comfortable during and after a day of packing than a substantially lighter pack that lacks a decent suspension, even if the overall load is 4lbs lighter.

Not everything translates well to oz's and lb's and a pack is one of them... I cut ounces everywhere, but not when it comes to my pack.