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#149560 - 04/24/11 12:51 PM Backpacking Pain
wandering_daisy Offline
member

Registered: 01/11/06
Posts: 2865
Loc: California
I will admit that I have never backpacked without some degree of pain before the day is done. Last year on Roper's High Route I had over 30 days of walking to figure this out. Regardless of the weight of my pack, it was the pack on my body that hurt first - mild saddle-sore hips and shoulders. This has always been the case, regardless of brand of pack. This kicked in after about 2 hours. After about 4 hours my Morton's Neuroma started - burning pain in my toe. In general, my entire feet are my number two pain source. On long downhill sections, the old knees started hurting after a few hours. At the end of the day my knees mildly hurt no matter what. The last thing to give out on me, even on days when I gained 6,000 feet elevation, was my breath or energy levels. Must mean my old bones and joints are in worse shape than my old lungs! I would be interested to hear of other's gradual "deterioration" on the trail! My average day's travel was about 6-8 hours, 7-8 miles and 2,000-3,000 feet gain on off-trail terrain at average elevation of 11,000 feet.

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#149562 - 04/24/11 01:30 PM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: wandering_daisy]
Glenn Offline
member

Registered: 03/08/06
Posts: 2617
Loc: Ohio
While my time on trail and mileage are roughly similar to yours, my elevation gain and loss, and elevation levels, are much lower.

I've always had similar issues with packs; after a couple of hours, they seem to have slipped a bit and are bearing funny, and at the end of the morning, or the day, it's nice to take it off for a bit. I'll sometimes experience mild "saddle sores" nowaday, and I find that the Thermarest and even NeoAir don't completely stop my hips from waking me up at night. (But that usually happens once or twice a night at home, too.)

The last year, I've noticed some pain in my knees, too. They'll become a little "ouchy" by noon, but then never get any worse. I've also noticed I become winded a bit easier than I used to.

And this mild deterioration had set in despite conscious efforts to carry less. I did find out, on my last hike, that I really don't have an option I thought I had. I had winnowed my gear down to two sets, equivalent in function but not in weight and convenience - and I thought my choice was going to end up made on the basis of convenience. The last trip, with a starting load of 32 pounds (which included 4 pounds of water, and would have been only 27 pounds with the lighter gear), has convinced me that I really need to choose based on weight. I found myself getting winded more quickly, and found my hips somewhat more sore at the end of the day. My knee was no longer "chatting" with me - it was carrying on a rather insistent conversation. I also am finding that I am not quite as agile as I once was. Stream crossings that once found me hopping rock to rock now find me stepping deliberately, placing my poles. I also find I'm not as graceful getting into and out of my chair kit - and that the chair is no longer a luxury!

Part of this may have been a matter of not quite being back in shape after a less than active winter, and part may have been a matter of trying to keep up with the 2.5 mph pace the younger folks were setting. But some of the soreness and lessened agility is age.

So, while it's no comfort, and won't stop either of us from continuing to backpack, you're not alone.

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#149563 - 04/24/11 01:59 PM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: wandering_daisy]
Pika Offline
member

Registered: 12/08/05
Posts: 1814
Loc: Rural Southeast Arizona
For me, my feet seem to be my major source of pain followed by pain between my shoulder blades after about 4-6 hours of hiking. I have problems with chronic, low-grade plantar fasciitis and, on occasion, issues with Morton's neuroma. If I tape my feet at the first twinge of heel pain and then take about 600 mg of ibuprofen, the fasciitis is fairly easy to manage. I hiked the JMT a few years ago and never felt a twinge.

The neuroma has become less of a problem over the years. When I was in my 30's and 40's and 50's and a very active climber, it would cause me a great deal of pain; especially when I was cramponing. I suspect that the climbing boots I wore compressed my forefoot exacerbating the neuroma; the crampon straps made it much worse. Now that I wear running shoes for almost all of my outdoor activities I seldom have any pain from "old Mort".

My shoulder pain is worse the first few days then seems to recede as the days wear on.

I am fortunate that my knees do not give me any trouble. I had a torn cartilage once but did it walking down the front steps of our apartment building confused . I don't use poles though I do use a hiking staff most of the time.

I was hit quite hard by a motorist while on my bicycle almost a year ago. I still have some sore spots from that. I have done three backpack trips in local mountains this spring and seem to have survived the accident fairly well. I have a permit for the Boucher Trail in the Grand Canyon for early May and feel up to that. Other than having had an enforced layoff for most of last year and having accumulated a bit of adipose tissue from the inactivity, all is apparently well (crosses fingers): I seem to have recovered pretty well for a guy in his 70's. I have a section hike of the PCT scheduled for this August of about 100 miles and am really looking forward to it.
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#149566 - 04/24/11 02:46 PM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: wandering_daisy]
oldranger Offline
member

Registered: 02/23/07
Posts: 1735
Loc: California (southern)
knees.....

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#149574 - 04/24/11 08:11 PM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: wandering_daisy]
skcreidc Offline
member

Registered: 08/16/10
Posts: 1590
Loc: San Diego CA
The pain in the sholders and on the hips seems pretty standard to me also. I feel I have the pack fit down now so at least I don't get wear spots where the top of the hips stick out on my back anymore.

Both my sholders have rotator cuff issues apparently from how loose my sholders are from all the swimming and surfing I have done over the years. Swimming ended up being a serious sport for me for about 10 years of my life. The last four years we were putting on 8 to 10 mi a day depending upon how close a meet was. Surfing took over when swimming stopped; a pretty easy transition. To correct it I have been at the free weights and other exercises. It is very slow going. I still cannot do a pull up without some pain although I can hange off of some bouldering problems now if the I keep the handholds in front of me and don't reach too far ahead.

At 54 I still feel pretty solid for backpacking, although I was having leg issues about 1 year ago. My knees were especially bothersome. I ended up working with a physical therapist who specializes in sports medicine. What she was having me do was something like this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9aJtO0VCqw

When he talks about being tender, its painfull! But my knees felt better after the first time. After a stiff trek I am stiffer again and it jumps up in pain level. However with the stretching, even my lower back has been affected in a positive way. Well anyway, this has helped increase my ability to do things again pain free (in general).


Edited by skcreidc (04/24/11 08:27 PM)

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#149575 - 04/24/11 08:49 PM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: wandering_daisy]
aimless Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 3292
Loc: Portland, OR
On last summer's major trip in Eastern Oregon I tended to hike about 9-10 miles a day, almost entirely on-trail. My average elevation was 7500 ft and average elevation gain was roughly 2000 ft/ day. These figures put me at a much less strenuous and challenging rate of travel than wandering daisy experienced on Roper High Route, going x-country.

However, at age 56, I can claim to have had no significant aches or pains during that trip. I have a minor neurasthenia in the middle toe of my right foot, but it is only a botheration, not so much as a real pain. My shoulders, hips, knees and ankles bore up perfectly well, and I think I only ate a few of the ibuprofen I took along.

So far, I normally experience only a few creaks and tweaks in my joints. I recognize this as the blessing it is and am appropriately thankful. I hope to keep going for a couple more decades before age-attrition finally knocks me to the side of the trail. smile

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#149577 - 04/24/11 10:24 PM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: skcreidc]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
I guess I'm lucky in that, for the most part, I run into fatigue before I run into pain. If I overdo things, my left knee (the one that had to be almost completely reconstructed 23 years ago) starts aching. Most of the time, though, the knee is OK unless my pack is too heavy or I've tried to hike too fast on extra-long downhill stretches. It has become obvious that I had better not plan on longer than 5-7 mile days (less if off-trail). If I try to do more, I can end up hurting all over by the end of the day, especially if there's a lot of downhill. I try to keep my trips easy enough and my load light enough to avoid pain. I'm out there to have fun, and when I start hurting, I'm not having fun!

I don't have particular discomfort from my pack as long as I keep the load lifters tight enough to keep the shoulder straps from putting any pressure on my shoulders and to transfer basically all the weight to my hip belt. I really lucked out with my pack (2005 model Six Moon Designs Comet). I assumed, after ditching my old external frame Kelty and not finding anything I remotely liked at REI, that I'd have to order and return at least half a dozen packs before finding what I wanted. The SMD Comet was the first pack I ordered. To my surprise, the pack felt as though it had been made to order just for me! I suspect that those having pain from their packs might either need a better-fitting pack or are trying to carry too much weight, or both.

Since switching from boots to trail runners, I rarely have foot pain unless I'm carrying too heavy a pack. This is weird because I have really deformed feet (bunions, hammertoes, fallen arches). Maybe I have a high pain threshold (though that's not evident when I visit the dentist!). I do need shoes with good arch support and anti-pronation features--none of those "barefoot" styles for me. Body Glide on my feet helps, too.

The real pain for me comes at the end of the day, while sitting around camp or, especially, lying down at night with the resulting pressure on my hip and shoulder joints. The summer I tried to convince myself that I was comfortable on a NeoAir was particularly awful. I was constantly tossing and turning trying to get comfortable and usually rolling off the stupid thing as a result. The weight savings definitely were not worth the considerable loss of comfort.

What has served me well, so far--all learned the hard way, BTW:
(1) Cut back more and more on pack weight as I get older.
(2) Find more comfortable gear (if necessary, cutting weight elsewhere) to fit my particular needs.
(3) Plan more flexible trips with shorter days and more layover/contingency days so I can tailor my trips to how I feel at the time (that varies, too!). I suspect that in the future I'll have to cut trip length so I'm not carrying so much food at a time. For example, I have a 10-day trip planned this summer, but it's one I can cut short if needed. At least I'll know the first day if the weight is too much for me, so I can stop and do some dayhiking, using two of the three planned layover days while I eat up some of the food!


Edited by OregonMouse (04/24/11 11:50 PM)
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#149578 - 04/24/11 10:53 PM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: OregonMouse]
ETSU Pride Offline
member

Registered: 10/25/10
Posts: 933
Loc: Knoxville, TN
The first backpacking trip I ever went on, my shoulders were hurting halfway through the trip. Between that first trip in December to my next one which was three weeks ago. (the March trip got postponed.) I spent time in the weight room doing workouts that strengthen your core. (if you want a workout list just PM me.) During my last trip, we did over 15 miles with 40 pound pack in one day. (two days totaled with close to 18 miles totaled) By end of the trip my feet were barely hurting and my left knee (which I bruised the week before while biking) was absolutely enraged with me. grin I had to drag it during the last half mile. lol. The next day wasn't that much fun as far as walking went and my collarbone was a little sore, but it went away in less than two days. My left knee was the only one giving me problem. My right knee was kind to me. My core didn't hurt at all. Either the workout program did strengthen it or it the fact I'm 21 and active or a little of both. cool I'll probably pay for it when I'm older, although. We did do some serious climbing and descending, but I'm unsure on exact gain/loss.

I climbed Mt. LeConte over Spring Break with a 25 pound day pack which took me 8 hours to do 14.5 miles. My feet were killing me by the end of the day and my knee joints were hurting too, however, the next day my feet pain was gone and my joint didn't hurt while walking on flat land, but climbing or going down the stairs wasn't exactly a breeze.

I'm still new to backpacking, and I'm looking forward to many miles of smiles and hopefully not too much pain. I'm still going to spend time in the weight room in an effort to keep the muscles active and strong between trips.



Edited by ETSU Pride (04/24/11 10:57 PM)
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It is one of the blessings of wilderness life that it shows us how few things we need in order to be perfectly happy.-- Horace Kephart

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#149579 - 04/25/11 12:00 AM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: ETSU Pride]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
It's the stress injuries from overdoing activities in your twenties and thirties that catch up with you when you hit your 50's, 60's and 70's (which is where most of us posting on this thread are). Keeping fit helps but won't prevent stress injuries. Hiking and backpacking are rather unique exercise in that about the only specific preparation exercise is hiking and backpacking. Sure, you can hike up and down stairs or around your neighborhood with a pack, but that's not the same thing as up and down steep mountains on uneven trails. It's best to start easy and work up!
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#149586 - 04/25/11 09:14 AM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: OregonMouse]
Kent W Offline
member

Registered: 10/15/09
Posts: 607
Loc: IL.
First off, ya cannot limit pain to 50 60 and seventy! Im 47 and have my share! Beating my body up on Heavy Equipment has taken a toll! I can say, I lightened my load this year by about eight pounds ,and it helped allot. My Total carry weight for 4 nights was around 30 pounds. I took to much food!
I used a G4 pack this year with a arched arrow back support pad in it. I had no shoulder or waist pain at all. First day was mostly uphill for about 3000 elevation gain. I had no trouble to speak of but I do go slow. We did about 7 to 8 miles a day. The third day On Goshen Prong trail was mostly downhill from the AT. Brutal on my knees calves and feet. My most noticable pain is after I stop for the day and everything tightens up. I take a Vicoden and feel much better. Sleeping in a Hennessy Hammock this year , my back felt awsome in the morning! Happy Trails!


Edited by Kent W (04/25/11 09:15 AM)

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#149591 - 04/25/11 12:35 PM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: wandering_daisy]
Mudflap Offline
newbie

Registered: 04/25/11
Posts: 13
Well I'm only eighteen and have been backpacking forever, and at the end of a day even I am sore everywhere. Particuarly the knees. I don't like taking meds, so I use Tiger Balm. It's a salve of sorts and it comes in a small glass container, very lightweight so you dont notice it in your pack. It's strong stuff, a little goes a long way so it'll last you an entire trip. Rub it on any sore muscles or joints and it feels great. you can buy it at drugstores. Also try and eat as much iron rich foods as possible. It's tough but iron raises your hemoglobin level which helps bring more oxygen to your muscles. This will help prevent fatigue after a few days on the trail.

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#149595 - 04/25/11 01:42 PM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: Kent W]
wandering_daisy Offline
member

Registered: 01/11/06
Posts: 2865
Loc: California
I am glad younger members are posting replies. I backpacked a lot when I was young but have forgotten so much. Plus so much has changed - a 65 pound pack and 5-pound clunker boots used to be "normal", now it is 30 pounds or less and trail runners. I my younger years I do remember that I had a lot of trouble with Achilles tendons- "squeek heel". I wore large climbing boots - now I use light hikers or trail runners and have never had Achilles problems. I also do remember that even if I hurt during the day, I never remember aches at night when I was in my teens and 20's even though I slept on those old hard a rock closed cell pads. Lingering aches may be an aging thing.

When I worked at NOLS we always said if you were hungry, thirstly, cold or in pain, you were doing something wrong. If hungry, then stop and eat; if thirsty stop and take a drink; if cold, put on more clothes; if in pain, solve the cause of the pain. I still think this is mostly true. When backpacking we are free to create many of our conditions. I have noticed that a lot of people are very reluctant to simply stop and take off their pack to solve a comfort problem.

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#149599 - 04/25/11 03:18 PM Re: Backpacking Pain [Re: wandering_daisy]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
I know a number of hikers who won't stop at all, and those who do tend to stop only for very short breaks--which is fine when you're trying to make distance in a hurry. I now have to take an hour-long mid-day break on backpacking trips I have to feed my dog small amounts three times per day to prevent vomiting. We therefore have to rest for an hour after his "lunch" to be sure it stays down!

I'm blaming this schedule on my poor sweet Hysson, but I have found that the hour midday rest helps me just as much! Afterwards I feel just as strong as I did when starting in the morning! I probably make up at least half of that hour in improved hiking speed before the end of the day.

Sleeping pads: It's funny how mine became thinner and thinner over the years! Of course it's really that my joints have gotten more sensitive!


Edited by OregonMouse (04/25/11 03:29 PM)
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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