Going to make a tent for two, which will be able to withstand horizontally blowing rain, to sit it up and wait for fair weather to come.
Know well what dome and tunnel tents are, what they capable of etc. But pyramid tens are known to me as mostly huge winter heated shelters and not as UL ones for two.
Obviously they are the easiest to make, and my rough counting shows they are the lightest, dome type in the middle, and tunnel one is the heaviest.
Anyway, the question is for real long term experience, how livable and practical those pyramids are? I have read many reviews, but they are seem to be biased or just advertisements.
My concerns: pyramids require too big area to pitch them, how often is it difficult to find that big area, I see it is difficult; much of that area is wasted, the fabric is too close to the ground to sleep or to put stuff under; the stick is in the center of everything, it is always on the way; too many hassle to pitch, especially on rocky tables or soft ground, too many stakes required on all grounds.

I'm a fan of "Baker's" Tents. Not sure how much wind you'll be dealing with but my little one has held up pretty well in some pretty good storms I've tested it in. I wasn't in it, but had it tied off good and it stayed dry inside and was still standing when I checked on it.

When it comes to comfort, it's the best thing ever. Mine's pretty small but two people can sit up in it with lots of elbow room, and three people are still comfortable. It's really easy to get in and out of, and it lights up inside really good with a LED light.

It's light, and cheap and easy to make. Materials cost under $40 and it takes maybe 8-10 hours to assemble. It'd be a lot easier with two people, but I made mine myself. Mine is not stylish, but it sure is sweet with a campfire on cold nights.

I hacked mine together just to test the concept of a "Super Shelter/Baker's Tent". It works far better than I'd imagined. Even if I didn't want to use on with a campfire I'd still make one out of silnylon or whatever because it's just so comfortable. I'll never go back to a dome tent, and I'm not a huge fan of the tunnel designs but I've not actually been in one so I can't say much about them.

One thing of note is that you can pitch a Baker's tent with a pair of trekking poles and guy lines and stakes, but if you're in trees you can tie it off to branches and you don't need poles at all.

Here's a few links to videos that show it. The last one shows it with the awning pinned down. It was set up like that when I had it out in the storms for testing. If you made one a foot deeper than mine you could sleep two in it comfortably, but I didn't really spend a lot time on designing this. I really just wanted to test it with a campfire to see how well it would warm up, and that feature is just amazing, but I also learned that the Baker's tent design is by far the most comfortable I've ever used.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DinUMoaTykE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdekfNtx65c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAmDtzpOYjg

Thank you for the kind and informative answer. I actually use a similar tarp pitched against a fire, I am in front of it and the tarp is behind me, reflecting the heat to the back side...

My question was directly related to very specific kind of tents, to pyramids or tepees. Here is an example from this very store http://www.backcountrygear.com/ultraligh...n-2-person.html
today everybody makes them, that is the current trend. But I am just not convinced they are so good as it said they are, and like to hear from those who really hiked with them, carried them as their only shelter, not just first impression, but rather second or even a third one, after very good and long term of use.

You listed all your perceived negatives to do with pyramid tents and they are valid points but every tent is a compromise one way or another.
In fact people that are strongly attracted to a particular design tend not to see why others don't like the same, for example some think that if a tent is not freestanding is not worth having whilst others immediately think "freestanding=heavy".
Don't get me wrong, I pretty much see it the way you do, yet the pyramid is one of the most popular designs and not only with the DIY crowd.
One shape that is easy to make but can have a smaller footprint and no pole/s in the middle is the A frame type, maybe that will do for you.

Well, A frame type needs at least 2 A-s, or even 3, which gonna move them toward the heave ones.
BTW, I came up with another imaginable or real pyramid drawbacks: the upper part of the zipper is over the sleeping area. Therefore, because every well protected zipper leaks under the right conditions, you gonna get wet. And that is true for all tent types having the entrance over part of the sleeping area, just matter of time.

Pyramids are out for me because the pole divides our shared sleep system. I've had no problems with zippers over sleeping areas, you learn to adapt. The last tent, now retired, was notorious for that, yet we used it at least 40 times in the rain, some of them mountain cloudbursts, without problems. I don't recall having a leaking zipper be a real problem in all my years of bag nights. Every design has its flaws, it's how you learn to understand limitations and adapt that makes them viable. Do you plan to incorporate a floor tub? Insect proof? Ventilation/condensation issues? True double wall, or single? Is less than a pound per person really that critical? Having spent some nights in single pole mids, I would only consider 2 pole designs for us. Double poles open up many more options than single. Singles also have a very limited section where head room is usable, unless the pole is very tall and inherently weakening the structure (and adding more material(read weight) and surface for catching wind . Also sil-nylon stretches when wet, so long planes tend to sag more than shorter panels, which may require restaking in the middle of a storm. If I chose to make DIY shelter I think the first thing I would tackle is making a list of exactly what my criteria for it was in all facets of design, then begin researching what I truly needed. Preconceptions of what works and does not, is not necessarily a good thing in deciding on a complex project. Hope it comes out great for you, a full blown 3 season tent is a pretty tough project, in my opinion.

I am researching tents to buy, not to make. Some new designs that look interesting are "High-Low" tunnel tents with a small bent pole at the foot end and then using two trekking poles to support the higher head end. You eliminate the tent-on-the-foot problem and then save weight with two poles on the high end.

The standard tent for NOLS Wind River courses is the Black Diamond Mega-mid. It is a 4-person tepee tent. I think that the tepee designs work better for larger tents. The center pole is less of an obstacle as the tent becomes larger. One big advantage is that you can stand up in the center. Tepee tents also work better as floorless shelters. Without a floor the lower side areas can be pitched over rocks since you will not be sleeping there anyway.

Tent material, either sil-nylon or cuben is expensive. I would make a prototype from an old sheet that you can then use as a pattern. I always feel more free to experiment when I am sewing on free material.

+1 Franco, shelters are a compromise

I went through this process recently and would recommend you make a list of priorities. As you know it is a long list and depends upon where your trips will take you. One thing I would put money on is you won't find a shelter to suit all your wishes. You will be doing well if you find a design to suit your needs.

Ours top three priorities in order were weight, interior space and condensation/bug control. Our current shelter is a BA FLy creek 2 which has served us well. There are many that find it unacceptable for its living space for 2 and those that cannot live with a front entry single door and some that cannot live with the overhanging entry as you mentioned. None of these were deal breakers for us as it is probably the lightest 2P double wall on the market besides the platinum series.

If weight is a serious priority for you and you can afford it, Cuben fiber will be your material of choice. You can't get a shelter in the more conventional materials at the weight savings Cuben affords.

I considered a MYOG single pole mid but when I did some layouts at home I soon found the interior space for a 2p mid was too confining in relation to the footprint needed to keep a reasonably small pitching area. A two pole design offers much more internal volume without growing the footprint greatly over what we have now. BUT, if I were looking for a 1p shelter IMO the single pole mid would be reeealy tough to beat.

Our next shelter is looking like a Zpacks Duplex design. It would allow us an 11 oz weight savings and a little more interior space with its two pole design. We will retain bug protection and gain a second door entry, both protected from straight falling rain but will have to sacrifice the two wall design of the FC2. Of course that will be our compromise and if we can't deal with any unforeseen condensation issue, its back to the little BA shelter.

Your priority list will soon lead you to the design that will most suit you. Good luck

Like others said, you need to prioritize what is most important to you.

You list two criteria: sit up in it, withstand horizontal rain. Does it need to withstand heavy wind? Usually horizontal rain means heavy wind.

I use a tarp and net tent for two. If I have heavy wind/rain, I can pitch it with one side on the ground. I can raise it as high as I want as well to sit up in. With that said, it probably isn't great in heavy wind, unless it is pitched really low, ie, can't sit up in it.

So, prioritize what is MOST important, and the right tent will present itself, despite it's drawbacks.

Thank you guys, I know all advises were given sincerely and with open heart, but I still need first hand experience based on prolonged usage of pyramid/ tepee type tent.
There still probably is 2 weeks of possible waiting time for decision to make, after that I will proceed with whatever I would had came up with. Meanwhile, the project has started, I completed bathtub floor, because it is going to be the same, while tent design can alter during that time.

Perhaps the fact that you have not gotten information about long term use is, in itself, informative? I can only recall seeing such a tent in use on the trail once, and that wasn't recently.

Edit: Decided the post was irrelevant.

I'll try again.
Getting comments on a forum has more to do with collecting anecdotes than facts and as they say the plural of anecdotes is not data.
To give you an example there is a particular tunnel tent design that a US company makes.
If you post about that brand at NWHikers you will have several members (well about 4 but it will seem a lot...) raving about it, now post exactly the same comment at Backpackinglight and several members there will tell you why it is rubbish (according to them)
In the same way, apparently, there isn't much love here for the pyramid design but I could give you the name of a forum where many will tell you just how fantastic they are.
(forum members tend to participate in forums with members of similar taste to theirs)

In the end most tent designs have been around for at least several decades, the pyramid is one of the most enduring and made by several brands so it must have a demand.
The point here is not if the design does work at all but if you think it will work for you.
Where others can help, is to determine the required size (I'm 6'3" will I fit inside...) and even then you will get conflicting opinions, or comparing weight, prices,finish , stuff like that.

"....plural of anecdote is not data..." Good one, Franco - I'll borrow that one, if you don't mind.

I'd also point out that not getting information you asked for is different than not getting the answer you wanted - which may be what's going on here, too. Not getting the answer you were hoping for could also be informative.

I can't speak for the other moderators, but I wouldn't object if you wanted to give the name of the pyramid-tent-favoring forum (we reference hammock websites, NW hikers, etc. all the time.)

BackpackingLight.
Loads of fans there for various reasons like DIY (every week someone will post their new creation) and the fact that the early Cuban Fiber shelters were made into mids (single or double pole pyramids)

At Outdoors Magic (British forum) there was a thread on the Golite Shangri La/Hex 3 (2-3 person pyramid tent)that lasted several years ending up after 44 pages, about 1000 comments.
There are several pyramid tents discussed there right now including the Nigor (GoLite copy) and the Luxe Outdoor models however clearly most British hikers don't use pyramid tents as you can see in this photo :

AMK, I think you answered your own inquiry in the last paragraph of your OP. Trust your judgement based on your needs. We all have differing opinions based on OUR needs.

The mids are awesome single person shelters. Light, easy pitching, large area for 1. Versatile when adding an inner net. Probably one of the most desired solo shelters out there. For two though, even the folks that love them for soloing will tell you they are cramped for 2. For the ULer's with some cash burning in their pockets the Duplex comes very highly rated. Generally speaking it would make a much better design for your MYOG shelter for 2, however I don't know what weight you would arrive at if made from silnylon or silpoly. Take a look at the NEMO's meta LE 2p to get a rough idea.

http://www.nemoequipment.com/shop/tents/?capacity=2P

In the end I decided against a mid because I wasn't about to talk myself or let anyone else talk me into a shelter that simply didn't fit my wife and I more comfy than our current shelter an certainly not if it was going to weigh more. YMMV

The nearest I have ever used to a mid was the Six Moon Designs Lunar Solo, which is a 6-sided sort of half-pyramid. It did very well in Rocky Mountain thunderstorms (my first six days out, it drizzled all day until about 4 pm when a whole series of back-to-back thunderstorms with hail and high wind gusts. seemingly from all directions at once, kept coming through until about 9 pm. It did seem a little more wind resistant than other tents I've used. I sold it because it was too small (not enough room for me and my 75-lb. dog. It was fine for just sleeping, but not when the dog and I were cooped up for several hours on end. I also found that the Lunar Solo had considerably more condensation than other tents I've used, such as the Tarptent Squall II or the Squall Classic once made by Gossamer Gear. I sold the Lunar Solo to phat of this forum in 2010. The last I heard, he's still using it when above timberline in the Canadian Rockies (when in the timber, he hammocks), and he's still finding a few stray golden Labrador hairs inside.

While I've looked at mids in the past, all the ones I've seen required a separate bug tent or ground sheet inside, which made the result heavier than a standard cottage manufacturer tent. I know that on some of his expeditions, such as his Alaska-Yukon expedition, Andrew Skurka successfully used mids from Mountain Laurel Designs. (Now that he's working for Sierra Designs, he probably won't comment on the MLD mids, but you can find accounts and gear lists of that AK-Yukon trip.)

In the end, only you can decide what tent suits you. Before actually sewing or buying one, I suggest you play around with a large tarp or some plastic to make a model tent of the design(s) you envisage. After my experience with the Lunar Solo, I srongly recommend a vent up at the peak, as well as around the bottom. Remember that if it rains on a regular mid, you'll have to close the door, or it will rain into about 1/4 of the tent. Closed-up tents get awfully soggy inside from condensation!

You might want to look at the tents made by Tarptent.com for other ideas.

You are the first one providing the real experience, thank you.

Now, of course everybody knows bacpackinglight forum, however you actually cannot post in there unless you paid some petty cash for the privilege to do so. And I am strongly oppose the idea of making money on information and opinion. Communication between people is free.

And yes, all, or I think they were all, reviews were read. But as stated at the first entry, all were "paid for" reviews, besides most were given after a first outing with a tent, and concentrated on fine details such as kind of guy lines or packaged size, while I was rather looking for design of the type, why it is better or worse, what is unique for only that type etc. Another type was given by those who is in business of hiking/travelling, their opinion has zero value because their equipment is not their choice but rather their sponsor, besides they change sponsors so often.

I agree, not getting an info is an info itself. And yes, all tent designs were known for centuries, ok, free standing domes and not so free tunnels were around for 4-5 decades. More to that, I have extended first hand experience of all of them, but tunnels. For example a UL type of a tarp with a bathtub floor and no seeumh mesh sides like above mentioned Duplex, I was using it 30 years ago when it was made out of canvas, not from cuben fiber. So what is new? Material only. All pros and cons are still there. It still light as it does not have a frame, and it still is not very comfortable, because it is single wall, has huge flat side panels flopping in wind and trowing inner condensation all over you. And so on.

Tepees, again, were used by me 30 years ago. But only as winter types, for group of 4 to 6, with a wood stove in the middle. Exactly as natives do, but not having supporting poles on its walls, and using a ski as a center support, and the rest of skies and poles as anchors. And those pyramids had half a meter or taller vertical sides, so there were not so much of covered area waste. And again, since it is a group, it is easier to clear the needed area, cut brushes or move a fallen timber if it is on the way, no rains, only snow to deal with, and so forth. Now, that is going to be totally different, because it is for 2 not for 6, less working hands, 3 season use, rain instead of snow, no wood stove inside. No vertical walls, the tent is too small to incorporate them. All mine theoretical expectations were given at the beginning, I know what I am speaking about, just need to confirm or refute mine thoughts.

I have posted several times at BPL and haven't paid a dime.

Really? I assume you have not paid for college or to learn a trade then. Have you not ever bought a book to learn more about something. Opposed to music lessons, art classes or guided tours ect.. Come on... $5 is a heck of a deal to join a community with that wealth of information, not to mention posting for sale adds that reach that sized readership targeted to UL BPing. What is wrong is to think that internet web sight operation comes free.



How much time have you actually spent at BPL? IMO you are woefully uninformed about the quality of folks there. Sorry but I can now see that nothing I can say is going to be of any value to you....GOODBYE

As long as someone else is paying for it, it's considered free.
Ask a politician.

As long as you want to play the odious comparison game:

This forum is free; it's paid for with backpacking-related advertising. BPL charges for use but has just as many ads, many of them annoying and most unrelated to the site's subject matter. That $5 fee is strictly an anti-spam device dating from horrendous spam attacks a few years ago. It does not give access to articles and probably costs as much to administer as it brings in for BPL

Customer service here is outstanding. On BPL it's nonexistent.

Although I have life membership in BPL, I stopped visiting the site regularly two years ago, because I was getting nothing useful out of it. Not one of the benefits originally touted for life members (such as no ads, access to what turned out to be Kickstarter-financed videos that never were made, involvement in strategic planning) has been implemented. The quality and number of articles has greatly deteriorated. One of the reasons I left was because for the previous two years they had published exactly one article that I found worth reading.

IMHO, BPL is worth the price of one year's membership, in order to read the wealth of articles in their archives, the best of which were published prior to 2010. There's lots of priceless info there about backpacking in soggy wet, cold, and other adverse conditions, state-of-the-market gear comparisons (although now rather out of date) and other useful information. Unfortunately, the site started going downhill just about the time I went to life membership!

Of course this site also has useful articles on its home page, and they're free to the user, too!

OK, diversion over, let's go back to tents!!!

Not sure to whom the "paid for reviews" comment was directed to, but as far as I know manufacturers do supply the item to be reviewed to BPL however there is no stated or implied condition that the review has to be positive.
In fact you will find several negative comments about many items reviewed there.
What is true is that there used to be more in both quantity and depth reviews than there are now.
Another site, OutdoorGearLab actually buy the items they review with some exceptions but not many.
I know for a fact, for example, that they bought at the standard price the tents from us (Tarptent)

Most bloggers disclose the source of the gear reviewed (bought, donated, whatever) and any relationship they have to the manufacturer (such as the Gossamer Gear Ambassadors). I believe this is an FCC requirement, not 100% followed, but usually. What I don't trust are gear reviews on retailer sites (I've had several reviews deleted by REI, and I won't even try on amazon.) I also found out the hard way that if Backpacker Mag recommends something, avoid it!

The trusted reviewers and article writers who once were mainstays on BPL (such as Will Rietveld, Chris Townsend, and Alan Dixon) have long since parted company with BPL and have their own blogs. There are a number of regular bloggers that I've found reliable and have a lot of good material: Sectionhiker, PMags, Andrew Skurka are three that I follow regularly. For stove info, Hikin' Jim's Adventures in Stoving (which sometimes goes a long time with nothing new). For the ultralight crowd, Hikelighter, Adventure Alan and Ultralight Insights.

You will find that most of us have our own individual preferences in gear, which makes it a bit hard to be objective. None of us has the financial capacity to try all sorts of different models. That's why I suggested to the OP that he do mockups out of cheap tarps or plastic.

OM just want to clarify, was the post starting with the above directed towards me. Just checking so that I don't make a mistake.