Mountain  Return to Pack Light

Polemic Dialogue

The Ten Essentials??

  • Ten Essentials - Yes or No ?? - Morrison & Lindsey

    Boots, Shoes, or Sandals ??

  • Running Shoes - Miwa
  • Boots vs. Shoes - Lindsey
  • Sandals - Starbuck
  • Running Shoes - Finch

    Filters, Iodine, or ??

  • Aqua Pure - Ben
  • Filters, Boiling, & Iodine - Lindsey
  • Lips to the Water - Starbuck

    Hot Food or Cold Food ??

  • Hot vs. Cold - Ty & Lindsey
  • Cold - Starbuck

    Grounds Sheets ??

  • Inside of Tent - Shields

    Dogs ??

  • Dogs (NOT) - Lindsey

    Other

  • Stephenson's Tents & Bags, the BEST ? - Brunberg

  • Polemic Dialogue based upon experience, rather than opinion, related to popular backcountry issues.

    This section isn't intended for engaging theoretical diatribe, rage release, or flame dispensation, but, rather, to share personal experience related to debatable issues.

    What is your experience and/or what has worked best for you, in the outback, and within what context -- where and under what conditions.

    In many cases, I find these controversies to be rooted in out-of-context mis-communication. People make comments like ".... all anyone needs when hiking is a pair of Converse tennis shoes ".

    Unfortunately, they fail to mention that their daypack never exceeds 15 pounds and most of their hiking is done in the local State Park where all trails are paved.

    Hopefully, the resultant knowledge base here will provide contextual information to help others understand the issues and make their own somewhat educated decisions in these controversial areas.


    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Running Shoes (instead of boots)

    Name: Craig Miwa, 6/3/96

    ....... the use of running shoes-especially trail running shoes -- instead of boots.... I have used them extensively outdoors and off trail and, as long as there's not a lot of snow, I have found them to be superb. The Adidas Trailrunner (not the Lite version--although that could be an option--it's not as sturdy) is excellent, lasts for ages, and can be waterproofed.

    It especially excels in wet, canyoneering situations (i.e., Southern Utah) where swimming with a pack is an issue because runners are all synthetic and dry MUCH more quickly than leather boots. I have found that, in about 90% of hiking situations, running shoes are supportive enough, LIGHTWEIGHT enough, sturdy enough and comfortable enough to outperform most boots any day of the week.

    ...... Try runners out for a while-with a light pack, you won't need the support of boots in most situations, and, if you hike alot, your ankles will be strong enough to withstand alot of bashing...I have done a week's trip with 18 lbs. plus food-using high end gear.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Hiking Boots vs. Running Shoes

    Name: Charles Lindsey, 10/05/97

    Incidently, "Hiking Boots vs. Running Shoes" is a long-standing, on-going debate.

    I use both in different situations.

    If I'm on-trail, exclusively, and the trail has good tread -- e.g., The Pacific Crest Trail -- I'm okay with a good pair of cross-trainer / running shoes. I currently have a pair of Vasque Exodus cross-trainers that are very comfortable. But even with a light (30 pounds max) pack, I find the soles not adequate, by themselves, to protect the bottoms of my feet from feeling the corners of sharp rocks and roots that protrude from the ground. To counter, I use a pair of Superfeet Cross-Trainer and Hiking Insoles. They are expensive ($27) but well worth it -- they protect not only the soles of my feet but also provide the arch support that I require.

    For rougher trails -- and there's a growing number of them in the Pacific Northwest due to lack of trail maintenance funds -- I use stout one-piece leather boots, exclusively. Interestingly, I don't think my rough-trail hiking boots -- Vasque Journeys -- are more than 1/2 pound heavier than the cross-trainers, and are, actually, just as comfortable, to me. But anyway, the soles of the Journeys are much more supportive on rugged trail tread and in off-trail, mountainous terrain.

    Lately, more hiking boot manufacturers are coming out with ultralight hiking shoes, such that, the cross-trainers are better designed and, thus, better suited for the backcountry. But even so, I would never say that cross-trainer / running shoes (either low or mid cut) are for everyone.

    My advice is to know yourself, find out what works and what does not. Don't blindly follow the biases of other people.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Sandals

    Name: Conrad Starbuck, 12/10/97

    ..... I got into lightweight backpacking when I realized the duplicity of that tiresome task of removing boots, donning camp sandals, drying feet, etc. adnauseam. I began experimenting with backpacking in sandals.

    .... On July 4th, 1993 I found myself at the Purgatory trailhead to begin an eleven day, 120 mile hike across the Weiminuche. My pack weighed 29lb 6oz (18lb 3oz sans food). My concessions to sentiment were a 5" lock blade knife, binoculars, and a fly rod. I post-holed thru more than a few snow drifts and my water bottle froze solid overnight near the Rio Grande Pyrmid. Never did I get chilled or my feet wet.

    Question from The Lightweight Backpacker to Conrad:
    ...post-holing in sandals and your feet didn't get wet. How'd you do that ? Gore-tex socks ?

    Yeh, gore-tex socks over neoprene socks over thick hikings socks to avert frostbite.

    I am convinced sandals are the best way to hike trails and mild off trail. Best sans socks on trails with many water crossings. Dusty or sandy trails cause grit to get under the straps and cause abrasions to the feet after about 10 miles. Lightweight sox are cool but very small twigs and pebbles are easily felt through them. Regular Thor-lo hiking socks are cool and comfortable.

    A stab of the sandal toe on the ground, log, etc., will quickly expel most debris trapped in the sandal. In over a thousand miles of hiking with sandals, I have seldom slipped or tripped and NEVER fallen. My explanation of this is, if a hiker in boots turns an ankle it is a unfortunate accident, but to a sandal wearer it is stupidty. I have learned to be very sure-footed and circumvent any embarrassment.

    A doctor friend whom I have converted to sandals explains the sure-footedness to the greater articulation at the ankle. Quiet simply, you don't get so far out of sorts with balance that you cannot recover. I hike in Amazone's by Reebok but there are new, and perhaps better, sandals to test.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Running Shoes (instead of boots)

    Name: Brian R Finch, 12/24/97
    E-mail: BFinch1@ic3.ithaca.edu

    I have found that by leaving the leather boots at home and using running shoes, I can cover ground much faster and save my feet the pain of 4 pound monsters.

    By going to a 1lb pair of shoes, you can take the equivilent of 15 lbs off your load. No other gear can have such an effect. This works really well on trails with sections on roads and heavily traveled pathes.

    Name: Brian R Finch, 12/26/97

    I do everything from day hikes to week long trips (or longer). Recently, I have been completing the Finger Lakes Trail. I have also hiked alot of the NJ, PA AT. I do some bushwacking from time to time in the 'dacks to explore. Most of my trips are several days on the trails (e.g., AT, FLT, Interloken national forest...etc. Trails that are marked and do not involve bushwacking).

    I started using running shoes because I felt that my feet were not benefiting from heavy boots. Boots generally were too heavy, do not have a ton of cushioning, and are a mismatch for natural biomechanics.

    I also had to be on a trip with a friend of mine, who wore Nikes and kicked my rear all over the trail. At the end of the day, I was tired ... and he wanted to do 5 more miles. Since then, I've been using lightweight shoes.

    There are times when I will still use boots and even plastic double boots. This is when I'm out during the dead of Winter backpacking or climbing. For most of the time (Spring-Summer-Fall), shoes are the way to go. Shoes will dry faster and have just enough tred to hold the trail. I would say that an average pack weight for me would be ~25lbs. I mostly use a Quest Summit 1 (3200). I use a backpack and not a day pack for the following reasons:

    1) A backpack places the weight on your hips. This reduces the possibility of nerve damage being done to the upper extremities. This can result from weight on the shoulders; no one wants thoracic outlet or carpal tunnel syndrome.

    2) Everything must fit in the pack. Items which are strapped on the outside are not stable. Such swinging items can cause increased stress at the hips, knees, and ankles. (I am a Student Physical Therapist)

    3) Have you ever tried to bivy in a daypack?

    I also own a Eureka! Endeavor (5900) pack. This works well when I have to carry a ton of gear on longer trips. I have carried 70lbs of climbing and camping gear in it. Yes, in running shoes!

    For most people and myself, shoes provide a good way to protect and support feet in warmer weather. I was out on the FLT on 12/22 in shoes and my feet did get cold when I stopped walking. There was also one foot of snow on the ground. I want to try a pair of gore-tex socks next time.

    ADIDAS work best for me. I have used several pairs of their brand.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Hot Food vs. Cold Food

    Name: E-Mail Exchange: Ty & Charles Lindsey

    • Ty wrote on 01/22/97

      To really lighten up, try bringing only cold food. This will eliminate stove, fuel and cooking pots.

    • Charles Lindsey wrote on 01/25/97

      In certain conditions, I agree. However, most of the backcountry travel I do around here is in the Cascade Mountains, where it can be 75 and sunny and 60 minutes later 45 and stormy, in August. I've gone out for a three day weekend with good weather forecasted, during the heart of Summer, and ended up negotiating a snow storm. My point is that hot meals or hot drinks can maintain your psychological and physiological well-being.

      If I'm going out for a day outing or a quick overnight, I will leave the cooking aparatus home, like you suggest. Most of the time, however, I'm unwilling to give up those hot meals and hot cup of tea at night and hot cup of coffee in the morning.

    • Ty wrote on 01/26/97

      I, too, relish the warm oatmeal in the morning with a cup of coffee, a hot bowl of soup etc. I regularly bring everything necessary to be assured of those pleasures. I don't mind the extra weight. (I primarily hike in the Sierra and Trinity Alps).

      The reason I mentioned the Light backpacking is I ran into a man in his 70's when hiking in the Hoover Wilderness (near Peeler Lake, a beautiful lake at the 9500 ft. level with a spill on the East and West sides of the Sierra) a few years ago and he was embarking on a 75 mile hike, he planned to complete in 3 and half days. Said he had done it when he was 35 and wanted to prove he could still do it. (he was on track to make it). During my conversation with him I commented that he appeared to be carrying little provisions. He explained that when he wanted to cover a lot of ground each day he brought a tarp and cold food.

      The following year, while planning a hike out of Hobo Gultch in the Trinity Alps I had to decide on a route. I remembered the experience I just related and recognized I would be able to make a loop, in the time I had available, rather then another "in and out" route, only if I were able to average twice my average miles per day. I think light backpacking (with cold food) is an option one should keep in mind if the desired trip dictates covering considerable distance in the alloted time.

      Otherwise, I'm with you. I love my stove and warm food.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Cold Food

    Name: Conrad Starbuck, 12/10/97

    I eat cold but will carry instant oatmeal, tea, etc. and heat it over a squaw fire in my sierra cup.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Aqua Pure

    Name: Ben, 2/13/97

    ......there may be a lighter alternative to all those filters. Have you had a chance to try Aqua Pure? It's a little glass bottle that's filled with iodine crystals. The bottle is filled with water which creates an iodine solution. The solution is added to "dirty" water at a prescribed rate (capfulls per liter), then you wait 30 minutes and drink. This system is virtualy infallible and it's a whole lot lighter that a filter. It doesn't clog, it's inexpensive ($12), lasts up to 2000 liters. Also, it tastes better than tablets, 1/3 the size of a small filter, quicker to use than a filter, and it is difficult to break (unlike most filters).

    My girlfriend and dog (Pete) used it for three months on the PCT last summer and it was awesome. It has limitations as to the temperature of water, etc... so it is probably more a warm weather solution to filters. Definitely a lightweight, lowtech approach to fastpacking!

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Iodine vs. Boiling vs. Filters

    Name: Charles Lindsey, 10/05/97

    Iodine is truly the cheap, ultra-lightweight water treatment for hard-core minimalists.

    I haven't yet tried iodine, but I've thought about it and may yet use it in certain situations. I do have some concerns about it.

    The problem here is threefold, (1) dirty water stays dirty -- albeit safe --, (2) it requires a lengthy wait while the iodine works its magic, before the water is safe -- like 1/2 hour or more for cold water (and all the water I use is cooold) --, and (3) ugh, it tastes terrible (unless you like iodine) -- all sorts of ways to mask the flavor, though.

    Another issue is how safe is iodine for long term use -- like over the length of the AT ?

    I know that iodine is not considered highly toxic, and in fact, it is an essential ingredient of human nutrition. However, continuous ingestion of large doses may cause health problems, particularly for people with thyroid problems, and during pregnancy.

    Anyway, that's where I'm at with regard to iodine. There's a bunch of info on iodine and other water treatment methods here:
    ARTICLE: WATER TREATMENT

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Lips To Water - No Filter

    Name: Conrad Starbuck, 12/10/97

    Water purifiers, What the hell is that.

    Get down on all fours, put your lips to that cool refreshment that quenches our bodily and spiritual thirst, and slurp the water with gusto. That will filter out any nasty bugs!

    And take the test. Can you take more than one sip without an involuntary rise of the head to check for danger. A sierra cup works nicely and use the same technique. Slurp with gusto. Giardia, yep. E-coli, that also. However, after being exposed I am now immune. At least, to just a bit more stomach gurgling.

    And isn't there something wrong with polluting mountain water with iodine or even running it thru a filter ? -------------------------------------------------------------

    Groundcloth Inside of Tent

    Name: Thomas Shields, 3/16/97

    A Ground cloth is needed if you use a tent or bivy. Not to protect the floor, but to prevent condensation by providing a vapor barrier.

    Careful selection of campsite takes care of protection.

    Most folks use a ground cloth that weighs up to a pound. The most effective way is to buy a very lite-weight painter's cloth (lowest mil, cheapest available at local hardware store). Then cut to size, get 4-6 pieces of self adhesive velcro (available at most hardware stores, REI, Campmor, etc.) and attach inside of tent in corners. It gives you the vapor barrier, if you track in a lot of dirt, etc., it's easy to fold up and remove, shake out, and replace. It will only weigh 2-3 oz., costs less than $1.00 to replace (I buy a 9X12 for $1.39 and get two replacements out of it).

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Dogs in The Backcountry

    Name: Charles Lindsey, 12/10/97

    Unfortunately, many dogs, who go into the backcountry, choose owners who are idiots. I've become so disgusted with irresponsible pet owners that I've quit taking my own dog on trail hikes, because I don't want to be perceived as part of the problem.

    The following is reproduced from this website's "Ethics...." section.

    A dog's bark in the backcountry is out of place, startling and even frightening both man and wild animals. Dogs unleashed and walking in advance of their master will frequently attempt to "protect" their master from oncoming hikers--this may be a growl or, as I have encountered, a violent knashing of teeth (darned if this didn't happen to me, again - 11/02/97). A dog crashing thru the underbrush startles and frightens all animals--including me. Dogs poop everywhere and anywhere. Masters typically don't clean it up. Stepping in dog poop is considerably different than stepping on llama, deer, elk, goat pebbles and bear scat--and much more offensive. Dogs fight each other and they don't care where. It's happened to me (more than once). In the middle of a narrow trail, my dog was on a short leash, at my side, the other dog was running loose and attacked my dog. On this occasion, the owner said, sorry, I don't know what got into him, he's not normally like this! On another occasion, the owner said nothing??

  • Always keep dogs leashed, on trail, and tied up, in camp. Most all State & National Parks don't even allow dogs, or if they do, the critters must be on a leash. If you don't like seeing your dogs fettered, then don't bring them !

  • Bury the evidence of your dog's defecation, the same as for your own.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Stephenson's Gear, The BEST ??

    Name: Rich Brunberg, 11/13/97

    We are using Stephenson's bags and tent. This stuff is expensive. It is incredible gear. The bags and the tent are the best stuff going. my partner and myself have been using various gear for over twenty years. We seek out bad weather and high altitudes. This stuff is incredible. If you want the best this is it !

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Ten Essentials - Yes or NO ?

    Name: E-Mail Exchange:
    Jim Morrison & Charles Lindsey, 2/12/98

    ESSENTIAL OR NOT ESSENTIAL, THAT IS THE QUESTION
    By Jim Morrison, Hansville WA

    Physical concepts are free creations of the human mind, and are not, however it may seem, uniquely determined by the external world. The Evolution of Physics, Albert Einstein and Leopold Infeld

    We have all been schooled in the so-called Ten Essentials. Sometimes I think we act as if they were being imposed on us, as if we were somehow choiceless in the matter. Well I for one object and here is my response to anyone who would say otherwise. How many of these ten items are really a matter of life and death? I would maintain not many of them. How important are they? I think I can show that there are other far more important things to consider.

    Let's look at some examples: map, compass, pocket knife and fire starter. If you are on established trails I doubt you will need a map unless you have some kind of attention deficit disorder. Consider making a reduced photocopy of the hiking guide if you think you really need it. How often have you said "Gee we would be lost without the compass"? In many years of hiking I have always enjoyed orienting the map and discussing the visible peaks, but the truth is, I have never really needed a compass. Better than relying on a compass learn the many ways of finding north without a compass! I really like my pocketknife for slicing cheese. If the Ten Essential gurus think it is indispensable for fire building think again. I have started all of my fires without a pocket knife, and quite frankly if you are in a hypothermic emergency you would be better served to put up a shelter and get into your sleeping bag. Starting a fire may not even be possible if it is raining hard or you are in an area where there is little fuel available.

    Yvon Chouinard is one of the great adventurers of our time, and the inventor/innovator of much modern mountaineering equipment. He goes so far (in his book) as to say that the Ten Essentials don't provide the best security at all, and goes on to say that if they slow you down (i.e. the weight of them) you would be better off without them. Does a first aid kit have anything to recognize or treat the symptoms of cardiac arrest, shock, neck or spine injuries, hypothermia, frost bite, heat exhaustion? No. Knowledge of emergency medical treatment is vital, a first aid kit is not.

    The heaviest of the Ten Essentials is extra clothing. I agree that this is a requirement and there are cases where you could not survive without it. However the Ten Essentials list doesn't tell us how much extra clothing to take, so it doesn't help. Rain gear and an extra shirt may be all that is needed in summer, but what about winter? Taking extra clothing is a no-brainer, take them. But tell me how much. This is a case where judgement is more important than some arbitrary list.

    Back to the original question: What is essential? Is food essential for survival? Yes, but not for days or even weeks. Water is essential, but usually not food. Of course if you are in the Alaska Range or Himalayas You might starve to death before you are rescued or walk out on you own.

    Again then: what is essential? A man goes walking on a trail in the woods with just the clothes on his back. After 5 miles it starts to rain hard and the temperature drops. He runs back to his car and takes shelter there. He survives without anything. A woman goes hiking and spends the night out. She has just a shelter, sleeping bag and two sandwiches. She gets sunburn (no sunscreen), wishes she remembered her sunglasses, and discovers her flashlight batteries are dead. Nevertheless, she survives. If anything is essential it was her sleeping bag and shelter. So "what is the Ten Essential list" you say, if not really "essentials"? They are things that are nice to have along. But what is essential, I think, is knowledge. Call it woodsmanship, mountaineering skills, judgement or just experience, it is essential. If you look at the accidents reported annually by the American Alpine Club you will find that most often lack of skills, lack of knowledge and bad judgment lead to accidents.

    Even Harvey Manning (Backpacking One Step At A Time, 1985, Vintage Books) said that "…there is a sliding scale of necessity" When he referred to the Ten Essentials. Colon Fletcher (The Complete Backpacker, 1971, Alfred A Knopf) doesn't make a Ten Essentials list and says "…everyone should evolve his own list." I couldn't agree more.

    Oh sure, I carry the Ten Essentials, I wouldn't even go on a day hike without them and more, but it is for convenience, because they are handy to have along and because at times they are downright useful.

    So next time you consider the ten essentials, consider them just a part of a list of many things to consider when you plan a trip. Use your own good judgement and don't be too influenced by an arbitrary list someone else considered "essential".

    ============================================

    ESSENTIAL OR NOT ESSENTIAL, THAT IS (STILL) THE QUESTION
    By Charles Lindsey, Snohomish WA

    It is prudent to carry The Fourteen Essentials and know how to use them. Common Sense for Backpacking Beginners, Charles Lindsey (unpublished).

    It is important for each one of us to continually project, in our mind, (1) what conditions could I encounter in the backcountry, today (and tomorrow)? (2) What gear do I need to provide, at least, a modicum of safety? (3) For me, what is the modicum of safety that I am comfortable with - that I can survive with?

    The Ten Essentials, in my opinion, is an attempt to standardize a grouping of gear that would provide that modicum of safety in most unexpected, emergency situations that most people would encounter, most of the time. Keep in mind, the 10 Essentials came out of the Mountaineers, who have a "group-think" philosophy (including me). There's something to be said for having a standard gear configuration when you have a group of people with varying degrees of experience and knowledge. It's easier to say .."everybody carry this stuff all the time".., then to wonder if the guy next to you has enough food or an emergency shelter or even a first aid kit. It's nice to know that all ten of the folks you go out with on a climb have certain gear and know how to use it. If someone gets hurt, I reach into THEIR pack for the gear that I already know is there, in order to help them. This can also be true when coming across a stranger who is hurt - it would be very useful to be able to reach into their pack and retrieve first aid or whatever, so I don't have to use my own. I might need it.

    Yes, when alone, I can get along without a lot of things, but that's not what I tell other people. I would say that probably half the folks who send me email are beginners. I feel good about prescribing 14 essentials to them. In fact, I would prefer not to see them in the backcountry without the 14 essentials and the knowledge of how to use them, until they become more experienced and learn to care for themselves in other ways. Search and Rescue stays busy enough, as it is, with people who go out without gear OR knowledge.

    Now, having said all that, I have to declare that I agree with you. In fact, I think the name "THE TEN ESSENTIALS" is a bit of a misnomer. I think "INSURANCE ITEMS" or something like that would have been more accurate for the Mountaineers intended usage, for, in fact, that's the function that the Ten Essentials are intended for. Essential Gear, in actuality, may vary from trip to trip, depending on terrain, geography, time of year, etc. More clothing, food, fuel, and a warmer sleeping bag are "essential" in the Winter. Snake Bite Kit may be essential when rock climbing in Central/Eastern Oregon and Washington. High Altitudes may require you to carry prescribed medicine for "High Altitude Sickness" and the list goes on and on. Essential gear is variable depending on....

    So, I don't think we disagree, ultimately, every person must evolve into their own set of "essential gear" for each situation that they will put themselves into, plus the "insurance items" that they require for that modicum amount of safety for unplanned emergencies.

    Finally, this is a very important and relevant set of statements taken from the bottom of The Lightweight Backpacker's Fourteen Essentials page:

    The most important essential , however, is not on the list--"Common Sense". Having the right gear is one thing, knowing how and when to use it is quite another. Most often, it's not a person's equipment that saves their bacon. It's their experience, know-how, and good judgment.

    Conversely, it is generally inexperience and lack of good judgment that gets people into trouble. Not only must we have the proper equipment -- including the ten essentials plus four -- and know how to use them, but we must also cultivate knowledge and wisdom related to the backcountry activities that we engage in--thru self-study, courses, and leveraging off the experiences of others.

  • -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Return to Index 
    ----------------------------------
    © Copyright 1997.