Feathered Friends 300x250
Superior Down Sleeping Bags & Clothing

Ultralight Adventure Equipment (ULA)    

   
 
 
Lite Gear Talk

Backcountry Gear Clearance and Sale

Amazon.com
Backpacking Forums
BackcountryGear.com
backcountry gear

---- Our Gear Store ----
The Lightweight Gear Store
 
 ULTRA-LIGHT 

Ultralight Backpacks
Ultralight Bivy Sacks
Ultralight Shelters
Ultralight Tarps
Ultralight Tents
Ultralight Raingear
Ultralight Stoves & Cookware
Ultralight Down Sleeping Bags
Ultralight Synthetic Sleep Bags
Ultralight Apparel


the Titanium Page
WM Extremelite Sleeping Bags

 CAMPING & HIKING 

Backpacks
Tents
Sleeping Bags
Hydration
Kitchen
Accessories

 CLIMBING 

Ropes & Cordage
Protection & Hardware
Carabiners & Quickdraws
Climbing Packs & Bags
Big Wall
Rescue & Industrial

 MEN'S APPAREL 

Jackets
Shirts
Baselayer
Headwear
Gloves
Accessories

 WOMEN'S APPAREL 

Jackets
Shirts
Baselayer
Headwear
Gloves
Accessories

 FOOTWEAR 

Men's Footwear
Women's Footwear

 CLEARANCE 

Backpacks
Mens Apparel
Womens Apparel
Climbing
Footwear
Accessories

 BRANDS 

Black Diamond
Granite Gear
La Sportiva
Osprey
Smartwool

 WAYS TO SHOP 

Sale
Clearance
Top Brands
All Brands

 Backpacking Equipment 

Shelters
BackPacks
Sleeping Bags
Water Treatment
Kitchen
Hydration
Climbing


 Backcountry Gear Clearance


 WINTER CAMPING 

Shelters
Bivy Bags
Sleeping Bags
Sleeping Pads
Snow Sports
Winter Kitchen

 SNOWSPORTS 

Snowshoes
Avalanche Gear
Skins
Hats, Gloves, & Gaiters
Accessories

Stay Healthy--Eat Well

MARY JANES FARM ORGANIC MEALS

Mary Janes Farm Organic Backcountry Meals

NATURAL HIGH GOURMET MEALS

Natural High

 

Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#196248 - 08/04/16 10:59 PM Condesation
Jim M Offline
member

Registered: 11/23/03
Posts: 235
Loc: Kitsap Peninsula, WA
I'm becoming a convert to tarps. However last night I spent a night up high in open alpine country and something interesting happened. We had clear skies and beautiful weather. I suppose it only got down to 45F at night. I had pitched my 7x10 tarp up high of the ground a foot or so in an "A" configuration and there was a nice breeze all night. completely open on two sides, of course. However, I got a ton of condensation on the inside and outside of the tarp. the breeze shook the tarp enough to make it "rain" under the tarp. My sleeping bag also got condensation, but has a relatively waterproof/breathable shell so it was not a problem. I always assumed enough ventilation would take care of the problem, but no way. It all dried out quickly when the sun came up, but had it rained or been cool and overcast I would have had to put everything away wet. Is there any solution to the problem of heavy condensation when atmospheric conditions are prime for it? Oh, and how do I add a jepg photo here?


Edited by Jim M (08/04/16 11:01 PM)
_________________________
Jim M

Top
#196250 - 08/05/16 09:18 AM Re: Condesation [Re: Jim M]
ndsol Offline
member

Registered: 04/16/02
Posts: 673
Loc: Houston, Texas
Look at the Admin Policy, Usage & Tips forum for how to post a photo.

Where exactly were you camping up high in open alpine country?

Top
#196252 - 08/05/16 12:01 PM Re: Condesation [Re: ndsol]
BrianLe Offline
member

Registered: 02/26/07
Posts: 1144
Loc: Washington State, King County
Quote:
"Where exactly were you camping up high in open alpine country?"


Exactly my question, and if I may elaborate in case that's not clear --- specific location can make a lot of difference in terms of temperature and humidity, such that two people camped in shouting (even loud talking) distance can have significantly different "climate" experiences. So for me, this question means things like, were there any water bodies nearby? Open fields? Particular low or high points nearby? Trees around, a lot, a few, none? What elevation? Wind blowing or not, and how much? Etc Etc etc etc.

I don't pretend that I understand the microclimatology of what goes on, nor that the exact same thing wouldn't have happened to me in your situation (sounds puzzling indeed!), but the local land-form and associated details are also IMO an important (set of) clue(s).
_________________________
Brian Lewis
http://postholer.com/brianle

Top
#196253 - 08/05/16 01:15 PM Re: Condesation [Re: Jim M]
aimless Offline
Moderator

Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 2838
Loc: Portland, OR
Good ventilation can reduce the condensation caused by the water vapor in our breath. It won't make any difference if the water vapor that is condensing was already in the air, in the form of relative humidity.

Top
#196254 - 08/05/16 01:47 PM Re: Condesation [Re: ndsol]
Jim M Offline
member

Registered: 11/23/03
Posts: 235
Loc: Kitsap Peninsula, WA
It is called
"Camp Freeze Out" on Kalhhane Ridge near Hurricane Ridgej, Olympic Mountains. We took the Switchback Trail up to the ridge and then the rugged trail toward Lake Angeles. Nice camp. Some snow patches, but no water. No bugs. Ref. Robert Woods.
Jim
_________________________
Jim M

Top
#196255 - 08/05/16 02:00 PM Re: Condesation [Re: BrianLe]
Jim M Offline
member

Registered: 11/23/03
Posts: 235
Loc: Kitsap Peninsula, WA
We were at 5830 feet. We could see the Straits of Juan de Fuca a few miles away and a mile below us. There were some snow patches, small and not many, about. No running water. No ponds or lakes. There was a 1 to 5 knot breeze blowing all the time. Probably 65 degrees during the day and 45F at night. Clear skies. No meteorite showers. No moon.
I think moisture that is in the air during the day wants to condense when the temps drop at night. It is like those little gas molecules are just looking for something to collect on. I remember from high school chemistry that super saturated solutions sometimes need something to start collecting on. If I remember correctly, I think it might be called nucleation. The molecules seem to be gregarious and the more they collect the more they invite others to the party.
_________________________
Jim M

Top
#196256 - 08/05/16 02:22 PM Re: Condesation [Re: Jim M]
Rick_D Offline
member

Registered: 01/06/02
Posts: 2801
Loc: NorCal
To oversimplify, temp dropped below the dewpoint and water condensed on both sides of the fabric, no doubt aided by your breath and ground moisture. If you were camped in a swale, cold moist air would have hugged the ground and flowed towards you, making things worse. Stronger wind could have resolved things but I don't know how to order that up. eek

It's sometimes possible to game the local microclimates by camping on a rise or hillside terrace. Not always an option though.

The covered breezeway at my house once had metal roofing that would basically rain on foggy, still winter days. The plastic it has now never does that, so the material has some kind of effect but I can't quite suss out why that is, other than heat conductivity. Do fabrics differ, e.g., material, coating type, color, thickness..? No idea.

Live and learn/rinse and repeat.

Cheers,
_________________________
--Rick

Top

Shout Box

Highest Quality Lightweight Down Sleeping Bags
 
Western Mountaineering Sleeping Bags
 
Lite Gear Talk - Featured Topics
Bivvy Sack combo Arrangement
by Jim M
10/18/17 01:58 AM
what is the lightest framed backpack around 40L
by toddfw2003
10/16/17 07:23 PM
a worthy challenger to the msr pocket rocket2
by the-gr8t-waldo
10/16/17 01:28 PM
Backcountry Discussion - Featured Topics
Backpacking/Camping Near Savannah, GA
by Sean&Brit
Today at 08:27 PM
Napa Fires
by balzaccom
10/11/17 07:43 PM
Backpacking the Ouachita Trail thanksgiving
by toddfw2003
10/05/17 11:54 PM
Make Your Own Gear - Featured Topics
lightest grommets to use
by toddfw2003
Today at 06:13 PM
alcohol stove comparisons
by Bike_packer
10/03/17 08:56 PM
Can footprint plasticizer harm tent ground-sheet?
by Weston1000
09/10/17 02:24 AM
Featured Photos
Breakneck Ridge, New York
May 2012 Eclipse, Lassen Park
New Years Eve 2011
Trip Report with Photos
Seven Devils, Idaho
Oat Hill Mine Trail 2012
Dark Canyon - Utah
Who's Online
2 registered (), 35 Guests and 0 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Sean&Brit, Blackbuzzard, LivelyLiz, Weve, Tones21
12425 Registered Users
Forum Links
Disclaimer
Policies
Site Links
HOME
Backpacking.net
Family Hiking
Lightweight Gear Store
Backpacking Book Store
Lightweight Zone
Hiking Essentials

Outdoor Gear Daily Deals
Outlets, Sales, Bargains

Our long-time Sponsor, BackcountryGear.com - The leading source for ultralite/lightweight outdoor gear:

Backcountry Forum
 
 

Since 1996 - the Original Backcountry Forum
Copyright © The Lightweight Backpacker & BackcountryForum.com