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#194528 - 03/25/16 09:15 PM hiking in tick country
toddfw2003 Offline
member

Registered: 01/08/16
Posts: 369
Loc: Texas
Is there anything you can put on or take that protects against ticks. I know dogs can use Nextguard. Today I backpacked in 6 miles for an over nighter. Within 10 minutes I counted 11 ticks on me and 7 on my dog. I ended up hiking out and going home


Edited by toddfw2003 (03/25/16 09:37 PM)

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#194529 - 03/25/16 09:40 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: toddfw2003]
SC Forester Offline
member

Registered: 05/12/12
Posts: 27
Loc: SC
Permethrin is your best bet. It can only be applied to your clothes before you put them on. DEET works ok. I have some success with using sulfur powder. These also work well for chiggers.

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#194532 - 03/25/16 09:58 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: toddfw2003]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
Variation of a blurb I write every spring:

Long pants. Long sleeves. Wear gaiters (with pants tucked inside) or tuck pants into socks. Button up your collar nice and snug. As the films they showed us in the 1950s in school told us, if the tick can't reach your skin until it gets as far as your neck, you'll feel it crawling and can remove it. Excuse me, right now my neck itches like crazy just thinking about it! laugh

These days we have new tick-spread diseases, especially Lyme (back in the 1950s it was just Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever, often fatal until antibiotics were invented that zapped it). We do have an effective weapon not available in the 1950s. Spray your clothes with permethrin. It's a pesticide, not a repellent. Be sure to follow label directions and keep far away from cats! Spray in well-ventilated area and let thoroughly dry. Don't inhale spray or get the wet stuff on your skin. Once it's dry, no issues. This also works great for mosquitoes (but not biting flies). The bugs-off treatments sold with outdoor clothing use permethrin, and, if you don't mind paying a higher price, last a lot longer than using the spray.

DEET works fairly well on your skin as a repellent, to supplement your permethrin-sprayed clothing. A thin line at the collar and cuffs will do (be careful not to get it on your watch!). Probably a good idea to wear a hat (sprayed) and put a line of DEET at your hairline.

Ask your vet for a recommendation for your dog. Around here (Columbia River Gorge) we've found Frontline (used to be the best) not so effective, and are using K9Advantix (which has permethrin--again, keep away from cats!). Note that these treatments do not repel ticks but kill them once they settle down and find a place to bite. If your dog has thick fur, the ticks may crawl around for quite a while before finding a spot to dine. If your dog has thin hair, the ticks will bite right away and you may have to remove them at every stop.. The stuff kills the tick supposedly before it upchucks its stomach contents into the dog's skin, but usually takes a half-hour or more after the bite..

As you can see, there will be ticks on your dog. Take a comb along and comb him thoroughly before putting him in your car or tent. When you get home, comb him again and check for ticks before letting him into the house.

Check yourself, too, clothing outside and your skin in the shower.

When removing a tick, don't grasp its body (use tweezers on the head) and don't use stuff like vaseline, gasoline, hot match heads, etc. All these will cause the tick to disgorge its stomach contents into your bloodstream, which is exactly what you do not want!

A deeply embedded tick requires a trip to the ER (or vet, for your dog). Also consult a physician ASAP if you develop a rash at the bite (the famous Lyme birdseye), or develop a body rash and fever (symptoms of Rocky Mtn. Spotted Fever).

Some places just have lots of ticks and are best avoided, especially in spring when they're most active. The worst places I've encountered are along the California coast. I'm going to be down there in a few weeks for a birding festival and plan to treat my clothing before I go!

For more info, here is an article I helped write.



Edited by OregonMouse (03/25/16 10:09 PM)
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#194533 - 03/25/16 10:11 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: toddfw2003]
billstephenson Offline
Moderator

Registered: 02/07/07
Posts: 3917
Loc: Ozark Mountains in SW Missouri
Yeah, permethrin is the most effective. I don't like it, but I'll be spraying a set of clothes with it here soon. It works pretty darn good for about a month, and you can wash your clothes several times and it still works.

BioUD is a natural plant based treatment for clothes. It has a somewhat strong odor. It doesn't smell awful, but it's there. It works good for about a week. They make a spray and lotion for your skin too, and the two of those together work very good if you (and those around you) can stand the odor. I'm okay with it, but my wife is not.

Given my druthers, I'd choose the BioUD. Permethrin is nasty stuff so I try to only wear my treated clothes when I'm outside with the ticks, and I get them off as soon as I'm inside. I may be a paranoid about that kind of stuff though. blush
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#194536 - 03/25/16 11:11 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: billstephenson]
toddfw2003 Offline
member

Registered: 01/08/16
Posts: 369
Loc: Texas
Wow, I have been hiking all my life and have never heard of Permethrin . I watched a video on it. Looks extremely effective. seems like you would only need to spray it on your pant. Looks like ticks die in 30 seconds after contact

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#194537 - 03/26/16 12:02 AM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: OregonMouse]
JustWalking Offline
member

Registered: 01/12/16
Posts: 293
Loc: PNW
When you treat your clothes at home with permethrin, it generally lasts through six washings or so. You can also send you clothes in to the Insect Shield folks and have them perform a permethrin treatment that will last for about 70 washings (they claim). I do it before each season for the clothes I'll wear that spring/summer/fall.

http://www.insectshield.com/IS_Your_Own_Clothes/default.aspx

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#194538 - 03/26/16 12:03 AM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: toddfw2003]
JustWalking Offline
member

Registered: 01/12/16
Posts: 293
Loc: PNW
Originally Posted By toddfw2003
Wow, I have been hiking all my life and have never heard of Permethrin . I watched a video on it. Looks extremely effective. seems like you would only need to spray it on your pant. Looks like ticks die in 30 seconds after contact


I do pants, socks and shirts. I even spray my gaiters and my hat.

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#194539 - 03/26/16 07:07 AM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: toddfw2003]
GrumpyGord Online   content
member

Registered: 01/05/02
Posts: 945
Loc: Michigan
It is interesting that I never even saw a tick until about 10 years ago. They were not a problem here in Michigan prior to that. Now they are a problem every summer. I don't know if it is because of climate change or a matter of the ticks evolving so that they can survive in the norther climate. Unfortunately the appearance of ticks and the appearance of Limes disease came at about the same time.

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#194540 - 03/26/16 10:22 AM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: GrumpyGord]
wgiles Offline
member

Registered: 05/19/14
Posts: 182
Loc: Central Illinois near Springfi...
Flea and tick season is just around the corner here, so it's time to get out the Insect Shield socks. Ticks seem to be most active as the weather starts to warm up. Fleas and chiggers are active all spring and summer. I find most ticks crawling up my legs, so I consider the socks to be the first line of defense. If they are really bad, I will add an insect shield T-shirt. I haven't seen the need to use treated outerwear. I do treat some of my clothes with Permethrin, but I prefer the factory treated socks and T-shirts. I doubt that Permethrin really penetrates polyester, so I don't have much faith in home treatment. Wool and cotton might be a different story, but I don't wear much of either in warm weather. Treating a ground sheet or the inside of a tent floor might be worthwhile, since they don't get laundered very often.

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#194541 - 03/26/16 12:57 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: GrumpyGord]
BZH Offline
member

Registered: 01/26/11
Posts: 1189
Loc: Madison, AL
Originally Posted By GrumpyGord
It is interesting that I never even saw a tick until about 10 years ago. They were not a problem here in Michigan prior to that. Now they are a problem every summer. I don't know if it is because of climate change or a matter of the ticks evolving so that they can survive in the norther climate. Unfortunately the appearance of ticks and the appearance of Limes disease came at about the same time.


Where in Michigan are you? I grew up in the UP and we always dealt with tics. Though I will say a couple years back I was hiking through a field on my parents property and the tics were thicker than I ever remember. I had to stop every couple feet to brush a half dozen tics off.

We had a standard routine when coming in from the woods. Clean all the tics off the dog, then strip down and get all the tics off ourselves. It is important to get them off the dog first... otherwise you'll just keep finding them on you.

I think OM's advice for avoiding tics is pretty solid.

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#194544 - 03/26/16 01:35 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: OregonMouse]
wgiles Offline
member

Registered: 05/19/14
Posts: 182
Loc: Central Illinois near Springfi...
I had a discussion with my vet this week on insect treatment for my dogs. The discussion centered on fleas, but ticks came up. He does not recommend Frontline anymore. If I remember correctly, he said that Frontline was not effective on ticks and recommended a collar for ticks. There are chewables that are more effective on fleas and combinations that treat for fleas and heartworm that are more economical then individual treatments. I have one dog that is allergic to fleas, so I have to treat both of them.

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#194545 - 03/26/16 01:56 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: wgiles]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
Did you ask about K9Advantix (the permethrin based treatment I have used)? The vets here don't recommend Frontline for ticks any more either--it isn't as effective on Columbia Gorge ticks. The K9Advantix seems to work well. Of course if you have a cat at home, you probably want to avoid using permethrin.
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#194546 - 03/26/16 02:29 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: OregonMouse]
Lonerock Offline
member

Registered: 12/10/15
Posts: 55
Loc: Southern Oregon
I've found that hiking at higher altitudes reduces the risk of encountering ticks. Avoiding drier areas with lots of shrubs such as manzanita also helps. Checking yourself and your partner for ticks frequently will catch them before they attach. I avoid using chemicals such as permethrin or deet when possible and usually use Lemon Eucalyptus by Repel for mosquitos and seems like it may help with ticks although I wouldn't rely on it for that purpose. Before the days of lyme disease in the West I used to come home on occasion and pull 2 or 3 embedded ticks off my body without real concern. Now, using some sensible steps I've had only a couple of ticks within the last few years. Removing a tick as soon as possible after it's attached will reduce the risk of lyme disease. According to the CDC, removing a tick within 24 hours results in only a very small risk of lyme disease.

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#194547 - 03/26/16 02:30 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: toddfw2003]
PerryMK Online   content
member

Registered: 01/18/02
Posts: 1391
Loc: Florida panhandle
I use a multi-faceted approach to repel ticks.

I use permethrin to treat clothes and gear. To save some money I purchased permethrin in bulk at amazon.com as the local Tractor Supply Store was out of stock. I mix my own at double strength from the pre-diluted brands (1% vs 0.5%) and still its less expensive. I guess this investment is only worth it if you use permethrin regularly and for a fair amount of stuff.

In addition to DEET I use ChiggAway, a sulfur based bug repellent. Sulfur based repellents are supposed to be better at repelling ticks, chiggers, and arachanids in general. DEET is supposed to better for repelling mosquitoes and other flying insects. I take MSM as a joint supplement (has sulfur in it) so maybe an internal ingestion of sulfur adds to the mix.

I use Dr. Bronners Tea Tree Oil infused soap for showering. Tea Tree Oil is supposed to be a general bug repellent.

The final thing is to avoid areas with heavy infestations. If there are enough of them, a few will break through the barriers.

I guess all this is working or I'm very lucky as I don't usually have a big problem with ticks.

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#194548 - 03/26/16 04:23 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: wgiles]
toddfw2003 Offline
member

Registered: 01/08/16
Posts: 369
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By wgiles
I had a discussion with my vet this week on insect treatment for my dogs. The discussion centered on fleas, but ticks came up. He does not recommend Frontline anymore. If I remember correctly, he said that Frontline was not effective on ticks and recommended a collar for ticks. There are chewables that are more effective on fleas and combinations that treat for fleas and heartworm that are more economical then individual treatments. I have one dog that is allergic to fleas, so I have to treat both of them.



Its called Nextguard

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#194549 - 03/26/16 04:25 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: OregonMouse]
wgiles Offline
member

Registered: 05/19/14
Posts: 182
Loc: Central Illinois near Springfi...
I'll have to ask him. He may have said something, but I don't recall. I have barn cats, so I'll need to address the permethrin issue with him.

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#194550 - 03/26/16 04:27 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: toddfw2003]
wgiles Offline
member

Registered: 05/19/14
Posts: 182
Loc: Central Illinois near Springfi...
Nextguard rings a bell. That may be what he was recommending.

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#194816 - 04/07/16 02:22 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: wgiles]
Zuuk Offline
member

Registered: 09/22/15
Posts: 70
Loc: NB, Canada
I was hunting one day, and walked through a grassy area to get to where I was going to sit and call for a bit. When I went to sit down, my legs looked like they were moving. I had obviously walked through a tick nest as I had thousands of ticks covering my legs. Basically everything from the waist down was crawling.

I'm not a bug person, so the heck with calling! I was frantically brushing my legs off, jumping around with the heebie-jeebie shuffle doing it's thing. Being alone in the woods at that time... Priceless! It kinda freaked me out having that many on me, so I ended up going home, shaking and washing all my clothes and doing a thorough search for the buggers on me. Luckily, none got through my clothes onto me, but the damage was done.

I ended up purchasing something called a Rhino Skin from Cabelas; not sure if they still carry them or not (or even if they still make them). Think of it like a full suit of pantyhose material, except tougher and not really prone to runs. Biting insects cannot bite through the material, although stinging insects can get through the fibers. So good for black flies which bite, but no good for mosquitoes that feed with a stinger of sorts. Of course I bought the camo ones so that it would look cool, although the plain green would have worked good too. I was in a camo phase at the time.

I wore them twice. Found they are a bit warm, until you move (same as pantyhose). They feel weird under your clothes because everything slides around over the top of them. Although now with the synthetic undergarments out there, I'm sure they would feel less weird now. The suit came with long underpants, long sleeve t-shirt, gloves & hood.

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#194818 - 04/07/16 04:52 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: Zuuk]
balzaccom Online   content
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Registered: 04/06/09
Posts: 2232
Loc: Napa, CA
We want photos!

I think we want photos...
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#194822 - 04/07/16 10:54 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: toddfw2003]
billstephenson Offline
Moderator

Registered: 02/07/07
Posts: 3917
Loc: Ozark Mountains in SW Missouri
Found it:

http://www.rynoskin.com

I think I might want to get a set of these.
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#194827 - 04/08/16 10:39 AM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: billstephenson]
BrianLe Offline
member

Registered: 02/26/07
Posts: 1149
Loc: Washington State, King County
Hiking with more experienced friends in an area where Lyme disease is a serious issue (more northerly part of the Appalachian Trail) --- from them I got into the habit of paying attention to where I would sit to eat lunch, take a break, etc. Never on a log, or grass, or bark chips, that sort of thing. Ideally on solid rock or concrete if available or generally just the most sterile-of-life place I could find.

Of course that's not sufficient in-and-of itself, but I only ended up with one tick to pull out on that trip, and it was a larger type (not the smaller deer ticks that one tends to get that disease from).
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#195821 - 06/15/16 09:32 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: toddfw2003]
backpackjaks Offline
newbie

Registered: 06/15/16
Posts: 1
Always take photos, its nice to look back on memories smile

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#195830 - 06/16/16 02:19 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: BrianLe]
billstephenson Offline
Moderator

Registered: 02/07/07
Posts: 3917
Loc: Ozark Mountains in SW Missouri
Yeah, here in the summer it's best to stay out tall grass and shaded areas with thick mulch, but ticks will be everywhere, even hot boulders and gravel bars along the creeks and rivers, though far fewer will be there.



I treated a set of clothes with permethrin for working outside about 6 weeks ago and they're still working. So far, ticks haven't been as bad here as some years, but we always have a bumper crop of something and this year it's mice and rats.

That said, I've been bit at least a few dozen times this year and every year since I lived here. Getting them off quickly is the key to avoiding getting sick, and keeping your immune system up makes a difference too, even in how much they itch after you've been bit.
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#195833 - 06/16/16 03:42 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: billstephenson]
GrumpyGord Online   content
member

Registered: 01/05/02
Posts: 945
Loc: Michigan
I just got back from a couple of days hiking in Michigan. Two dog ticks, no deer ticks but hundreds of slugs. Set something down and it is covered is slugs. In the morning I took at least 50 slugs off from the tent. I have had some before but nothing like this. Had a little rain but nothing unusual.

I wonder if they are eatable. Certainly plentiful enough.

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#195834 - 06/16/16 04:17 PM Re: hiking in tick country [Re: GrumpyGord]
OregonMouse Online   content
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Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
Quote:
I wonder if they are eatable. Certainly plentiful enough.


There are lots of slugs in France, where escargots (snails) are a delicacy, but I never heard of the French eating slugs.
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