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#186683 - 08/20/14 03:44 PM Recommend a Pack
Boogie Offline
newbie

Registered: 05/24/14
Posts: 12
Hey folks, I am looking for a new pack, and was wondering if you could recommend a make and model. It needs to have the following:

65 or 70L
Removable top
Lightweight
Big enough to fit bear canister
Sleeping Bag Compartment
Comfortable


I realize that comfort is subjective, but I just want to get an idea of what everyone is using, get me looking in the right direction in today's market. Thanks in Advance!

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#186692 - 08/20/14 05:24 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
Glenn Roberts Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 2208
Loc: Southwest Ohio
In the Osprey line, the Volt or Aether series, or the Atmos (I've made the assumption you're a guy - If you're a woman, it's the Viva, Ariel, and Aura series.)

Deuter should also have something in its ACT, ACT Lite, and Aircomfort series.

None of the above are ultralight - they're lightweight (under 5 pounds), but probably toward the heavy end of what most people on the forums use. They will also handle signficantly heavier loads than most of us carry. Personally, I use an Osprey Kestrel 48, but that's a lot smaller than you're looking at.

In the end, it's driven by comfort - a good fit, and the ability to comfortably carry whatever amount of weight you're going to put in it (which you also didn't tell us.) The only way to tell that is drag your stuff (including food and water) to the store and try several on - it will take several hours; call ahead to find out when they won't be busy, since you'll eat up a fair amount of their floor space while you play. Good shops will let you do this; if yours won't, find another shop.

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#186694 - 08/20/14 06:46 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
+1 for everything Glenn said! I personally cannot use Osprey; their hip belts and my hips consistently disagree, with much pain to the latter. But lots of folks do well with those packs. I personally prefer a smaller and lighter pack, but my gear is pretty light and compact.

The most important part, though, is not the brand, or the features, but fit, fit, and fit--pack has to fit you, fit your gear and, most of all, be comfortable for you with your specific gear in it. Pack fit is almost as individual as shoe fit! That's why nearly everyone recommends purchasing your other gear first, your pack last.

_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#186708 - 08/21/14 04:57 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
Rick_D Offline
member

Registered: 01/06/02
Posts: 2939
Loc: NorCal
You might take a look at the ULA Catalyst. It has no sleeping bag compartment or removable lid, but you don't need those. Instead, stow your bag in a drybag with shouder straps for use as a summit pack.

It will handle a canister, sideways, and can be custom-fit to a significant degree. They're very tough packs.

Cheers,
_________________________
--Rick

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#186751 - 08/23/14 12:43 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Rick_D]
JPete Offline
member

Registered: 05/28/09
Posts: 304
Loc: Eastern Ontario
Let me throw in another possibility.

I am extremely happy with my pack from MLD. It is customized (Very inexpensive) and is somewhere around 45 litres (I know that because what's in there fit snugly into a 45 litre pack before).

The pack fits me like a glove, and feels snuggly even after a 20-mile day (though I've done only three of those since I got it). I probably should mention that with five days of food and a litre of water, it weighs about 15 or 16 pounds. The pack itself weighs one pound.

In a way I probably cheated a bit. I needed a new pack and I was in Virginia at the time, so I took my old pack (that had lasted through a whole AT thru-hike) and all my gear plus five days of food and some water bottles to Roanoke and got measured for a new pack. I believe it is slightly larger than the off the shelf model it is based on.

I realize this is the second posting today in which I have mentioned MLD gear. I should mention that I have no financial connection with Ron, other than paying him for my equipment.

best, jcp

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#186764 - 08/24/14 01:50 AM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
jasonlivy Offline
member

Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 654
Loc: Colorado
This is my third post tonight about the Granite Gear Nimbus Access Trace 70, but it should be in the conversation.

Granite Gear has a very good reputation with fit and durability and this pack is the epitome of both. It is one of the easiest packs to load, uses Cordura fabrics exclusively, and has a maple wood (fiberglass encased) molded frame sheet that performs surpassingly well. This pack is literally the accumulation of 15+ years of Granite Gear pack design.

The only thing it doesn't have on your list is a dedicated sleeping bag compartment. I don't think you'll miss it though. Although this may push you away I would recommend you give it a look. One of it's best design features is the panel load that uses internal compression straps to lock in the load and force it to the back of the pack. This makes packing and unpacking super easy. I love that I don't have to worry about where I put my first aid kit or rain jacket...everything is accessible without worrying where it was packed.

The weight of the pack is important and compared to other packs in this size range it is one of the lightest at 4lbs, 2ozs. Contrast that to the Osprey Aether at 4lbs, 11oz and the Gregory Baltoro at 5lbs, 10oz.

In terms of packing a bear canister there is not a backpack made that is as accommodating for a bear canister as is the Nimbus Access Trace. It makes packing and accessing the canister much easier than a top load or a hybrid loading pack. And using the internal compression straps you can access other items in the pack without having to take it out.

I agree with everyone else that fit is the main thing to consider. If a Granite Gear pack fits you then you are well on your way to making a very smart investment!

Warning: My Opinion...
I am one of the more out-spoken critics on screen printing, specifically screen printing on packs, that you will meet. I personally feel it is a total waste of money and is only used to 'persuade' the customer that shelf appeal matters. As anyone who has anything that's been screen printed knows, eventually it falls off or wears away. After a few years of use a screen printed pack looks the opposite of what it looked like on the pack wall at the gear store. I would avoid screen printed packs at all costs, although that is becoming much harder these days. I personally feel it is a shame that pack manufacturers have gone to this tactic to sell more packs! It adds zero value to a pack, has nothing to do with it's performance, and actually adds additional costs to the manufacturing of the pack which means that other things suffer like materials, construction, quality, etc. What many manufacturers are doing is focusing on shelf appeal but compromising on materials to keep costs down. A prime example is the use of (or the lack of) Cordura materials. I remember when I first got in to backpacking, any pack that didn't use 100% Cordura (aka. 'Kodra') was considered low-end. The average consumer cannot tell the difference but there is a huge difference in durability. Unlike Gore-Tex that requires a jacket to be entirely made up of the material in order to put it's name on the jacket, Cordura will allow it's tag to be put on the piece of gear even if there is only a tiny bit of fabric that is actually Cordura, a common tactic that many pack manufacturers use. Today you'll find the much cheaper 'Kodra' (or it's equivalent) material on many high-end packs, most in the pack's worst wear points (bottom material, side material, etc.), to accommodate the cost of screen printing. It's a shame...
_________________________
Believe, then you will Understand...

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#186771 - 08/24/14 02:03 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: jasonlivy]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
Thanks, Jason, that's good to know!
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#186773 - 08/24/14 06:30 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: jasonlivy]
Glenn Roberts Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 2208
Loc: Southwest Ohio
Thanks for reminding us of Granite Gear, Jason; they made (and I assume still make) an innovative and greatly functional product. I wore out one of the original Vapor Trails, and could never quite make the Virga work (I see it finally got a lightly-padded hipbelt.) After my first Vapor trail, I couldn't get the replacement to fit right (never sure whether they moved the fixed suspension length, or I shrunk (I'm about an inch shorter than I was 15 years ago.) About that time, I started using lighter, less bulky gear, and drifted away from the brand because the volume was more than I needed.

Anyhow, I'm curious about your take on materials. I'm not trying to contradict what you said, because I don't know that much about the technical aspects of pack cloth - I really do just want to understand better. If I'm interpreting correctly (and I may not be), it sounds like you're saying other makers (like Osprey?) use screen printing to "hide" the fact that they use inferior materials? I know that all the packs I've used in the last 15 years are made from lighter materials than the old Dana, Lowe, and Camp Trails (yes, I'm that old) packs I use - including my old Vapor Trail (which, I believe, had a lot of silnylon in it.) I've never had any problems with any of them failing. That makes me wonder if makers now use inferior materials, or have just realized that the really heavy duty fabrics of the olden days were way overkill, and that lighter fabrics will still provide sufficient strength and durability for most users.

Granted, I backpack in the eastern US, where I'm not dragging packs across granite or otherwise subjecting them to hard use. I can see how use might require stronger materials for some users.

So, what is the difference between the materials used by Granite Gear and other makers? (And for what it's worth, I don't like screen-printing on my packs, either. The Atmos and Kestrel models I currently favor seem to have less of that than other packs in the Osprey line.)

Again, I'm not trying to argue - you've just given me a chance to learn more about pack technology.

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#186807 - 08/25/14 07:35 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
Boogie Offline
newbie

Registered: 05/24/14
Posts: 12
Hey there, does anyone have any experience with this pack.

http://www.mysteryranch.com/mountain-adventure/expedition-packs/big-mountain-pack-ex

It is heavy, but Dana has been known to make a great pack.

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#186812 - 08/25/14 10:41 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
aimless Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 3292
Loc: Portland, OR
It is heavy

You can say that again. The specs list it as 5 lbs 4 oz (2.4kg)!!

I have never owned a pack that heavy, either external or internal frame, and I've been backpacking for more than 40 years. I cannot fathom the need for a pack to weigh that much to do the job of carrying gear, clothes and food. What's even more astounding to me is that its capacity is a fairly pedestrian 3966 cu-in (65 liters).

I admit that I know nothing else about this pack other than the specs I have just mentioned above, but those two specs alone would put me off it, whether it was in 1970 or 2014. Even before discovering the price was $295.

But, if that is your cup of tea, who am I to say you are wrong to want it? blush




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#186817 - 08/26/14 11:14 AM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
I fully agree with aimless--no need for a pack that heavy. It weighs more than my "Big 3"--tent, pack, sleeping bag--combined!
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#186819 - 08/26/14 11:59 AM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
BZH Offline
member

Registered: 01/26/11
Posts: 1189
Loc: Madison, AL
I have no experience with it however I have heard they are very nice packs designed for hunters to carry out large game and such. Heavy packs designed for very heavy loads


Edited by BZH (08/26/14 11:59 AM)

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#186827 - 08/26/14 06:50 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Glenn Roberts]
jasonlivy Offline
member

Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 654
Loc: Colorado
Glenn, I'm glad to see you're still really into gear! My wife says she can't imagine anyone as in to gear as I am. I'm glad to be among good company here!

Granite Gear's fit has become much more refined over the years. They've also got a complete line of really nice day packs (Glacier Series) with real waist belts and much better colors (only the model name and brand is screen printed). As mentioned earlier the Leopard series and Nimbus Trace Access packs are some of the best multi-day lightweight packs on the market, IMO. Granite Gear's focus is still function. Everything revolves around it being comfortable and durable first and foremost. Everything else is a distant second.

As many would attest to, pack design has seen little innovation over the years. To be fair, backpacks do not lend themselves to being overly complicated. This isn't to say manufacturers have tried. I've seen some real bad designs (early Mountain Hardware load bearing packs) that were just too much.

However what I'm seeing (and hopefully seeing going away) is trendy screen printing in many of the new pack designs with little else in terms of innovation. I think it's a travesty to imagine that someone would buy a pack simply based on it's screen printing image, or worse, it looks cool on the pack wall. I've seen packs from several manufacturers, not just Osprey, which have the whole front and back of the pack covered in screen printing! I can only surmise that the reason is to take advantage of the customer's mis-understanding of what is most important in buying a pack. I know many people who have succumbed to this draw, but who later are disappointed with their purchase. Now if the person buys a heavily screen printed pack, not because of the screen printing, but because they've determined it fits them and their needs the best, then fine. But when folks are being manipulated because of 'shelf appeal', or they put more importance in the look of the pack over it's function/durability, then I have an issue with that. I believe that happens more often than not...

My previous comments were based on a candid conversation at the OR Show with someone on the inside of a certain pack manufacturer and was told point blank that their #1 mission was to have the best looking pack on the wall. In essence this person told me that they didn't use 100% cordura on all of the materials due to the expense that was required to make their packs look good (which included the expense of screen printing) and to stay competitive price wise. In other words, their focus was first shelf appeal and then function/durability.

I didn't show it then, but I was kind of disgusted with this premise. This has festered inside me to this day. And the sad thing is most are buying packs based on look vs function/durability.

I asked one of my the best pack dealers in my territory (who is a huge Osprey dealer) what they personally use. None of his employees, including himself, carries an Osprey for multi-day trips. This shop does carry a variety of other packs including Granite Gear, Arc Teryx, Chilo, Hyperlite, Crux, and others. I asked him which pack he carries and owns, and he told me a Granite Gear. However, you would think it would be easy to sell packs to him, but that is not the case. Why, because what he sells is shelf appeal and he knows he and his staff don't have to work as hard selling these packs (namely Osprey). With the resources Osprey has, can you imagine what they could design if their total focus was function and durability? One can only dream (yes, I've seen, and tried on with weight, their new designs for 2015 and my first impression is it has an immense amount of shelf-appeal...however, I would never carry one of these new packs on a multi-day trip knowing what other packs are out there...they seem very delicate and once the tension of the back panel material wears out, then the whole concept of the pack fails).

I'm also bugged with packs that have excessive seams just for the sake of shelf appeal. If a seam is needed for a certain function then so be it. But when they are put there just to create a design or add a different color of fabric then what's the point (i.e. Deuter)?

In my opinion these are two small examples of how pack design has let everyone down. We should demand more through our purchasing power...
_________________________
Believe, then you will Understand...

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#186828 - 08/26/14 07:31 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: jasonlivy]
Glenn Roberts Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 2208
Loc: Southwest Ohio
Thanks, Jason - I fully agree. I like the build of Deuter packs, but can't seem to find one that fits me right:(the load lifter tabs are all attached too low - same problem I have with the Osprey Kestrel 48. They're sold as one size fits all, when in fact one size fits some. The Kestrel is sold as a M/L, but when you stand it next to an Atmos Large, the point where the load lifter attaches to the frame is an inch and a half higher; put it next to an Atmos Medium, and it's the same height. I ended up having the same problem with replacing my Vapor Trail: I tried the Nimbus Ozone and a brand new one (can't remember the name - had a lovely long zippered pocket down the back that held my rain gear perfectly), and the attachment points were simply too low to let me get the 45 degree angle. Although I like my Kestrel, I may end up using my Atmos 50 simply because it gets the load lifter angle right.

As far as screen printing, I don't much go for shelf appeal either - thus, I'm not overly impressed with racing stripes, or for that matter with gimmicks like "stow on the go", sleeping compartment dividers (really? you're afraid of having your gear touch your bag?), sleeping bag access zippers (my pack is empty by the time I'm ready to get my bag out), energy gel pockets on shoulder straps, or really even hipbelt pockets (though if they're large enough, they can be useful - as long as you put stuff in it that isn't hurt by being bent into a curve.) Double-compartment top lids are mostly pointless, as are the cute little mesh pockets on the underside of the lid. But they look cool, and let you put a really long list of "features" on your hang tag. I also don't see any real reason for multi-colored packs, for that matter. (I'll stop here, before I start waxing nostalgic over my old green Camp Trails Adjustable II pack.)

Yeah, I'm a gear junkie - I'm starting to suspect that choosing the owner of the local backpacking shop as my recovery partner may be part of the problem. I'll give him another year, and if there's no progress... smile In the meantime, I may have to ask him why he no longer stocks Granite Gear. Thanks again for the information.

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#186831 - 08/26/14 08:00 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Glenn Roberts]
OregonMouse Online   content
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6799
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
Quote:
They're sold as one size fits all, when in fact one size fits some.


That has been my big problem with packs. The other problem is that while I'm not petite ("short and stout" is a better description), my torso length is 15". While I do have a backpack that fits well, I have an awful time finding a supportive day pack that isn't way too long for me. I refuse to carry a daypack that is heavier than my multi-day backpack (29 oz.), and most woman-specific backpacks weigh almost 3 pounds. I do need some stiffening in the day pack plus a hip belt to get the weight off my very sensitive shoulders. It seems that even the cottage manufacturers figure that what fits a man will fit a short and stout woman, too. I beg to differ!
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#186875 - 08/30/14 03:33 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
Boogie Offline
newbie

Registered: 05/24/14
Posts: 12
So what is a good weight to look for, for a 65-70L pack?

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#186939 - 09/02/14 02:53 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
wandering_daisy Offline
member

Registered: 01/11/06
Posts: 2865
Loc: California
If you need 65-70 L, that implies heavier loads. The heavier the load you carry, comfort is more important then pack weight. Exactly how heavy is your load?

I have a 2#12 oz pack that I use for loads under 40 pounds. I am not UL - for a 14 day trip I end up with about 42 pounds. I suffer the first few days because it actually is overloaded for the suspension until I head a couple of days food.

Over 40 pounds (carrying food for others, grandkids gear, or a serious alpine climbing trip) I go to my old Kelty external frame. You can load it up, carry odd-ball sized stuff (like a bear can or climbing rope)and with the extension bar you can distribute the load in many ways. I have redesigned my Kelty and sewed a new bag of lighter material so it weighs 3.5 pounds. I have also used just the frame, and slung a 1 lb Granite Gear pack on as the pack bag.

If the pack weighs over 5 pounds, it probably is made of too heavy material - like others said- may be designed for hunting or other purposes than general backpacking.

The bear can is a HUGE issue with me. Not only is it big and heavy, it is rigid - put in a pack vertical, it ALWAYS makes the pack more uncomfortable - stiffens the back where you want it to contour your back. With the Kelty, I strap the bear can on the top (attached to the extension bar). Also, many packs can accommodate a bear can horizontally only if you are a men's large or x-large. I have not found a single woman's small pack that accommodates a bear can horizontally. A horizontally placed bear can, at the top of the pack, eliminates the stiff as a board feeling on your back.

I suspect that many of us who backpack a lot on trips of varying lengths and varying goals own several packs. Personally, I would invest in at least two packs instead of a one-size-fits-all situations.

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#186948 - 09/02/14 07:37 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Glenn Roberts]
Glenn Roberts Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 2208
Loc: Southwest Ohio
Correction: my local outfitter just got me to try this year's version of the ACT Zero 50+15. I don't know if they tweaked it a little, but it seems like the load lifters attach to the pack at a slightly higher point this year (or I shrunk a bit). He got a fit that gives me a 30 or 35 degree angle on the load lifters, as opposed to the 5 or 10 I could get on the Kestrel.

And there's one other point you'll like: no silk-screening. The minimal amount of labeling is all embroidered. smile

I'm not dumping my Kestrel any time soon, but I'm hoping I've finally found a Deuter pack that will work for me.

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#187176 - 09/24/14 09:16 AM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
Boogie Offline
newbie

Registered: 05/24/14
Posts: 12
I went with the Aether 70L, just because the price was right. It seems very comfortable compared to my stone age north face pack.

Thanks for the recommendations!


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#187436 - 10/20/14 10:25 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
Outcasthiker Offline
member

Registered: 12/13/10
Posts: 60
Loc: Tennessee
Check out this site for lightweight large packs. http://www.hyperlitemountaingear.com/ultralight-packs.html

I use the 4400 Southwest pack and love it.
_________________________
Never Pass Up a hike!

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#190657 - 05/24/15 05:41 AM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
Honas Offline
member

Registered: 05/24/15
Posts: 26
I can't recommend this pack because I haven't used it but I am looking at the same problem set of carrying a bear canister and I think the ULA Epic might be a good light-weight solution.

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#190686 - 05/25/15 01:38 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
PeterK Offline
member

Registered: 08/21/13
Posts: 24
I own a Osprey Aether 85. I used this pack for 6 days trips to 15 day trips. The main reason why I went with Osprey is:

Warranty is outstanding.
It's only 4 oz less then the 60 liter, so you can adjust the straps if your pack has less volume.

I hope things helps.

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#190716 - 05/27/15 09:24 AM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
sotafan Offline
member

Registered: 04/14/15
Posts: 22
Loc: Minnesota
Originally Posted By Boogie
I went with the Aether 70L, just because the price was right. It seems very comfortable compared to my stone age north face pack.

Thanks for the recommendations!



Boogie--I bought this same pack. I needed the larger size since we need a bear keg where we go. I have used it twice on weekend trips and love it. I am a bigger dude and did a much of research before I bought it. Nice choice. I know there are some on here that talked about "shelf appeal" but for the size you were looking for, the Aether 70L should be great!! I didn't like the other option in the larger bags. The smaller bags seem to be flashier, IMO and I would rather have the larger pack and not need it then have a pack where half my stuff is hanging outside of the pack. It defeats the whole purpose.

Good luck, enjoy!


Edited by sotafan (05/27/15 09:25 AM)

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#190983 - 06/17/15 11:35 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
bob1900 Offline
member

Registered: 06/16/15
Posts: 19
Atmos is not bad

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#191013 - 06/18/15 11:10 PM Re: Recommend a Pack [Re: Boogie]
milan Offline
newbie

Registered: 05/27/14
Posts: 2
I know this is an old topic but it may help someone else. I bought an Osprey Aether 60L based off of recommendations from this site. It is the perfect size pack to fit everything you need including a bear canister (I use a bearikade weekender for reference). I thought about going with the next size bigger but I am glad I didn't as it would just be wasted space or cause me to carry something extra I don't need to take. I love it although my nephew bought one also and he complained the hip belt dug into his hips and was uncomfortable. I have had no such issues.

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