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#177147 - 05/17/13 10:14 PM Re: Backpack for my son [Re: Swizzle]
topshot Offline
member

Registered: 04/28/09
Posts: 242
Loc: Midwest
Hmmm... you may want to feed him more. A 43 pound 9 year old? Seriously? How tall is he? My 46 pound 6 year old has always been small for his age.

Anyway, at that age I'd skip over the Tarn 18 for sure since he's sure to hit a big growth spurt any day. Sadly there aren't any lightweight (< 2 lbs) kids packs that are adjustable torso that I know of. As I said, I'll likely end up making my son's next pack. After that one I have a women's small Golite Jam that should work well. That's what I and his older brother use (also for Scouts).

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#177149 - 05/17/13 11:51 PM Re: Backpack for my son [Re: Swizzle]
rockchucker22 Offline
member

Registered: 09/24/12
Posts: 751
Loc: Eastern Sierras
Originally Posted By Swizzle
I kinda get the feeling everyone thinks I'm standing behind him with a whip and forcing him to climb a mountain with a loaded pack. That's not the case at all. I would take his whole pack if I needed to. His pack before he left the house was down to 15lbs and I ended up carrying his sleeping bag and his tent. I know that overloading him would only keep him from enjoying the outdoors and that is the last thing that i want to do.
First off hats off to any dad taking his kid/kids out camping! It does seem a bit overkill about the weight a kid carries but it is absolutely critical to the success of integrating a child to a life outdoors. Again you are so far advanced as a parent involved and encouraging, the next step is to gracefully take the advice from those who know better. Please keep it up and don't give up on us and reread the advice given, it's not to critique you, but to complement your excellent effort! Pm me if you need any one on one info.
_________________________
The wind wont howl if the wind don't break.

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#177156 - 05/18/13 11:11 PM Re: Backpack for my son [Re: Swizzle]
Steadman Offline
member

Registered: 09/17/09
Posts: 514
Loc: Virginia
I'm an external frame user, and I ended up buying internals for my two older kids (now 8 and 10) that backpack with me.

My kids are long and skinny - the 8 year old just went over 50 pounds, the 10 year old just went over 60 - 25th percentile for weight/75th percentile for height. I know what you're facing here...

topshot's advice about weight is spot on. Weight and warmth are the only important things here. Once you're walking, you're warm, but the bag has to be warm enought at night, because there might not be a fire. Weight is important because you can't move if it's too heavy.

I started all my kids (the third one is joining us this summer) with their ten essentials at 6, and I focused on weight when I bought them, and limited the amount of water they carried. I'm keeping the kid's packweight at 10% of body weight - and did three mile in/three mile out sort of hikes with them.

I just bought the almost 10 year old an REI comet - they are on sale at the outlet, and if you order them delivered to your local store they are easy to return if they don't fit. Internals are harder to load well than externals (as it sounds like you experienced).

An alternative is DJ2's pack which is a lightweight external that you'd have to build. I am still playing with this option for me. If I can get it to work this summer I'll start playing with it for kids.

Best advice (and it sounds like you're going there anyway) is to get a scale, make a gear list, and weigh everything that went into your son's pack last time. That will guide your efforts to lighten his load.

Second piece of advice; consider sharing a shelter. Scouts usually work on the buddy system, and tents are HEAVY unless you buy specialty gear (see the conversations on this site).

Good luck with the challenge you're facing. It's hard to teach new skills.

Steadman
(occassional backpacker and father of 4).

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#177546 - 06/02/13 11:39 PM Re: Backpack for my son [Re: Steadman]
kevinhansen Offline
newbie

Registered: 04/15/13
Posts: 10
This is a good thread. I have 4 little ones, the oldest just turned 8. Tomorrow we are all going for a beta test hike. We will try the tape on items trick to see what we don't use.
Kevin

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#177548 - 06/02/13 11:43 PM Re: Backpack for my son [Re: kevinhansen]
rockchucker22 Offline
member

Registered: 09/24/12
Posts: 751
Loc: Eastern Sierras
Originally Posted By kevinhansen
This is a good thread. I have 4 little ones, the oldest just turned 8. Tomorrow we are all going for a beta test hike. We will try the tape on items trick to see what we don't use.
Kevin
awesome! Please post a trip report!
_________________________
The wind wont howl if the wind don't break.

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#178028 - 06/25/13 09:33 AM Re: Backpack for my son [Re: Glenn Roberts]
Glenn Roberts Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 2208
Loc: Southwest Ohio
And now I have to eat my words. I just tried the new version of the Osprey Atmos 50 pack this weekend, and I think it may become my go-to pack. If I had to classify it, I'd say it was an external frame pack: you can see the frame, and it has a trampoline backpanel. However, it's not the old aluminum-pipe frame, with a three-quarters length pack bag pinned to it; it's small-diameter aluminum with an internal-style packbag firmly affixed to it. It doesn't have the "bounce" usually associated with external frames, nor does it move against you when you turn. The packbag is an uncluttered design that has all the features I use, and none that I don't (except for ice-ax loops; not that many snowfields and glaciers in Ohio.)

As I looked at other Deuter and Osprey models, I seem to see a lot of trampoline backs with frames buried inside the pack - a perimeter frame, usually, instead of the old X-style stays or single stays. They look like internal frames, but they have some of the structural advantages of external frames.

What I learned (talking to a visiting friend from Virginia, who works in an outfitter's there) was that the Osprey Kestrel and Deuter ACT Zero packs did not fit me as well as I thought. While the adjustable torso length could be set right, the problem came with the load lifters: the frame itself (the lenght of the back of the pack) was too short, and as a result, I was getting a zero-degree (or even negative) angle between the frame and shoulder straps - which was why I could never get the load entirely off my shoulders. (At 18 pounds, it never got truly uncomfortable, but my shoulders were a bit tired at the end of the day. I thought I was just out of shape.) The Atmos frame was a couple of inches longer, and I now have a good 45-degree angle between the shoulder straps and the pack frame - and the load can come entirely off my shoulders.

So, now I'm starting to think that it may no longer make sense to think of "internal v. external" but instead to simply say that you need to get the pack that is most comfortable for you. The lines between the two types appear to have blurred considerably, and the pack makers seem to now borrow freely from the best of both styles to make some "hybrid" packs that don't fit easily into either category.

As I found out this weekend, you're never to old to have an "Aha!" moment (or, in my case, a full-blown Homer Simpson "Doh!" moment.)

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#178564 - 07/21/13 02:17 AM Re: Backpack for my son [Re: Swizzle]
lesspayne Offline
newbie

Registered: 07/20/13
Posts: 1
Swizzle
I'm new here but I have ordered what I think is the perfect pack. It is a MOLLE style pack. It weighs a mere 1.5 pounds and is the most versatile pack I have ever seen. You can carry any load you want, from you lightweight summer setup, your winter setup, it can carry tools and equipment, it can be stripped down after you have made camp and used to carry firewood back to the camp. The pack is also adjustable. Both the shoulder straps and the hip belt adjust to fit any size torso so as he grows you can adjust the pack to fit him. And I can go on and on about his pack so let me shut-up and post a link to the Molly Mac Pack (MMP) http://www.mollymacpack.com/pack.html.
It's not very pretty but watch Rat's reviews on you tube he gives a very good detailed view of the pack and shows how to build different loads. I don't work for the company but I highly recommend them.

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