Backcountry Forum

Make Your Own Gear

Amazon.com
Backpacking Forums
BackcountryGear.com
backcountry gear

---- Our Gear Store ----
The Lightweight Gear Store
 
 WINTER CAMPING 

Shelters
Bivy Bags
Sleeping Bags
Sleeping Pads
Snow Sports
Winter Kitchen

 SNOWSPORTS 

Snowshoes
Avalanche Gear
Skins
Hats, Gloves, & Gaiters
Accessories

 ULTRA-LIGHT 

Ultralight Backpacks
Ultralight Bivy Sacks
Ultralight Shelters
Ultralight Tarps
Ultralight Tents
Ultralight Raingear
Ultralight Stoves & Cookware
Ultralight Down Sleeping Bags
Ultralight Synthetic Sleep Bags
Ultralight Apparel


the Titanium Page
WM Extremelite Sleeping Bags

 CAMPING & HIKING 

Backpacks
Tents
Sleeping Bags
Hydration
Kitchen
Accessories

 CLIMBING 

Ropes & Cordage
Protection & Hardware
Carabiners & Quickdraws
Climbing Packs & Bags
Big Wall
Rescue & Industrial

 MEN'S APPAREL 

Jackets
Shirts
Baselayer
Headwear
Gloves
Accessories

 WOMEN'S APPAREL 

Jackets
Shirts
Baselayer
Headwear
Gloves
Accessories

 FOOTWEAR 

Men's Footwear
Women's Footwear

 CLEARANCE 

Backpacks
Mens Apparel
Womens Apparel
Climbing
Footwear
Accessories

 BRANDS 

Black Diamond
Granite Gear
La Sportiva
Osprey
Smartwool

 WAYS TO SHOP 

Sale
Clearance
Top Brands
All Brands

 Backpacking Equipment 

Shelters
BackPacks
Sleeping Bags
Water Treatment
Kitchen
Hydration
Climbing


 Backcountry Gear Clearance


Stay Healthy--Eat Well

MARY JANES FARM ORGANIC MEALS

Mary Janes Farm Organic Backcountry Meals

NATURAL HIGH GOURMET MEALS

Natural High

 

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#171658 - 11/08/12 09:24 AM Is your backpacking stove unstable? ***
Racoon Offline
newbie

Registered: 11/07/12
Posts: 7
Loc: New york
Hello fellow backpackers,
I am currently enrolled in a High School technology class where i must identify a problem and design and produce a solution for it. I am investigating the stability of common backpacking stoves and possibly going to design a universal mechanism to stabilize backpacking stoves. In order to verify my problem I have drafted a survey and this is the link to it: I am asking if anyone could please fill it out it would help me out tremendously, i would deeply appreciate it.
-Xavier

(admin's note to op: if you want to conduct a survey you may do so within the confines of this forum. We suspect Survey Monkey is used to mine user ip's for advertising/spamming purposes and do not allow it's use here.)





Edited by packlite (12/07/12 07:05 PM)

Top
#171660 - 11/08/12 09:29 AM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: Racoon]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
I filled it out, but it's a little biased because I know of several products on the market that stabilize canister stoves already.
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

Top
#171661 - 11/08/12 09:46 AM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: lori]
Racoon Offline
newbie

Registered: 11/07/12
Posts: 7
Loc: New york
Thank you for filling out my survey.
I was just wondering if you could elaborate on why you believe the survey is bias. Also, if possible could you be specific about the products you mentioned before so I could investigate them? Thanks again.

Top
#171663 - 11/08/12 10:19 AM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: Racoon]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
I'm biased because I quoted the lowest price I've seen for a stabilizer. Haven't seen the need for buying one, because you want flat spots to place the canister anyway, and I've never failed to have a flat spot.

_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

Top
#171665 - 11/08/12 11:29 AM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: Racoon]
Samoset Offline
member

Registered: 07/04/08
Posts: 429
Loc: Newnan ,GA
Here's a problem $COST$ most quality items are made by big name brands! If you could manufacture say a stable, light canister stove of your own! Thats capable of boiling efficiently water as well as simmering at a fraction of the price. Say half of the average marketed price. And the item be of the Same quality & let's throw in made and assembled in the USA.

Then My Friend you have identified and created a solution.

Otherwise there are plenty of nice stable stoves out there if your willing to pay for them.

But I'm with Lori even on mountain sides its usually not to hard to improvise a bit of a flat spot. And if your truly in a situation were a flat spot is Improbable . A lot of stove manufactures make hanging kits
_________________________
Some peopole live life day by day. Try step by step.

Top
#171672 - 11/08/12 02:00 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: Samoset]
Cranman Offline
member

Registered: 01/21/12
Posts: 133
Loc: Central NC
He was asking about stability of existing stoves. I have a MSR rocket and I have meant to pick up one of the plastic stabilizers, Jetboil makes one that snaps onto the bottom of your fuel canister.

Top
#171675 - 11/08/12 02:21 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: Cranman]
OregonMouse Offline
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6400
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
In addition to the commercial ones mentioned, there are many homemade solutions to the stability of canister stoves, such as 3 titanium shepherd hook stakes (which most of us carry for our shelters), 3 halves of wooden clothespins plus a rubber band. I've never seen the need for any. I want my stove on bare ground anyway to avoid catching any dry vegetation on fire, so if the surface is sloping I generally level the ground with a stick, replacing the surface dirt removed afterwards.

Level ground is necessary anyway, whether or not the canister is stabilized, because if the burner surface is slanted the pot will slide off. This inevitably happens just when your water is just starting to boil!


Edited by OregonMouse (11/08/12 02:31 PM)
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

Top
#171683 - 11/08/12 05:05 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: Racoon]
wandering_daisy Offline
member

Registered: 01/11/06
Posts: 2752
Loc: California
The design issues remaining for backpack stoves are fuel efficiency (reducing loss of heat)and wind protection (which is a big factor in heat loss). Some pot/stove systems have a heat exchanger built into the pan, but these are still quite heavy. I would think a good project would be to accurately measure heat loss (in various conditions, cold,windy, sunny, shady, etc)for several of the commercially available stoves out there, and then design gadgets or stove modifications that significantly reduce the heat loss. Look into such things as burner size vs pot size - what match has the least heat loss. Another factor, pot shape - does a tall skiny pot heat water faster than a wider lower pot?

Top
#171684 - 11/08/12 05:19 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: Racoon]
Brotherbob12 Offline
member

Registered: 04/05/04
Posts: 71
Loc: Sweden
Hi
Stability in canister stoves can be a problem. I use a plastic support with three legs. It works fine. It is not absolutely necessary but fot instance in forest with lots of soft moss a hard flat spot can be difficult to find.

Top
#171722 - 11/09/12 09:13 AM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: Brotherbob12]
Tobi Offline
member

Registered: 11/09/12
Posts: 24
Loc: Buffalo, NY, U.S.
In that case, would you be willing to take our survey? Xavier and I would greatly appreciate your input. (We are both members of the group that is currently exploring this topic.)


Edited by Tobi (11/09/12 09:28 AM)

Top
#171727 - 11/09/12 09:33 AM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: wandering_daisy]
Racoon Offline
newbie

Registered: 11/07/12
Posts: 7
Loc: New york
Thank You. My group is taking your thoughts into consideration. We would also appreciate you taking our survey as well. If anyone else has any other ideas on problems you run into while camping that you might want to be solved feel free to post them here.

Top
#171737 - 11/09/12 12:41 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: Racoon]
billstephenson Offline
Moderator

Registered: 02/07/07
Posts: 3889
Loc: Ozark Mountains in SW Missouri
I'm going to offer that you might consider focusing on the popular "DYI" stoves used by a lot of backpackers.

Google "Pop can stove", "Penny Stove", "Supercat stove", "homemade alcohol stove" to get started learning about them.

These might benefit from a well designed stand, especially one that's easily made by the user. Besides added stability, some of these stoves also have another problem that could be solved with a stand. When it's cold they can be harder to light and could benefit from some insulation between them and the cold ground, maybe a way to warn the fuel too.

Let us know what you come up with!
_________________________
--

"You want to go where?"



Top
#171738 - 11/09/12 12:44 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: billstephenson]
billstephenson Offline
Moderator

Registered: 02/07/07
Posts: 3889
Loc: Ozark Mountains in SW Missouri
Okay, now I took your survey. I don't use one of those stoves.
_________________________
--

"You want to go where?"



Top
#171742 - 11/09/12 01:18 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: billstephenson]
OregonMouse Offline
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6400
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
I took the survey but would never consider the Pocket Rocket (the stove pictured) because its pot supports appear quite fragile (which has been noted in reviews). Mine is a Primus (since discontinued); another high quality brand is Snow Peak.

As mentioned before, I make sure my stove is set on bare ground and level the ground under the canister if necessary, so I have no need of any separate device to make the stove level.

Should you wish to address a more complex and more important issue with canister stoves, there are two: First, the isobutane/propane mix fuel does not perform well in below-freezing temperatures, although using a remote stove that allows the canister to be turned upside down (keeping the propane part from evaporating first) helps a lot, as does keeping the canister warm before and during use. Second, without a scale (something most of us have at home but certainly don't take backpacking) it's difficult to tell how much fuel is left in the canister.

As mentioned by others, many--probably most--lightweight backpackers use alcohol stoves. I have both but prefer the convenience of the canister.
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

Top
#171759 - 11/09/12 09:17 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: Racoon]
oldranger Offline
member

Registered: 02/23/07
Posts: 1735
Loc: California (southern)
I have been using a Pocket Rocket regularly since it first came to market and the pot supports have worked just fine all that time for the one to two person meals I have prepared on the stove. I have never had a significant problem with stove stability because I have always been able to find a small flat surface on which to set the stove. If a natural surface is not readily available, I fiddle around and prepare one before I set up the stove and begin cooking.

A little ingenuity is much lighter than yet another gizmo weighing down the pack.

Top
#171763 - 11/09/12 10:09 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: oldranger]
Glenn Roberts Offline
Moderator

Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 1378
Loc: Southwest Ohio
I've used Pocket Rocket, Snow Peak Giga, Jetboil, MicroRocket, and Superfly canister stoves, I usually use a .8L pot (Titan Kettle), relatively low and compact. The only one I ever used a stabilizer with was the Jetboil, because its pot is taller and narrower, and the rig is slightly tippier. Otherwise, I never needed one. Like others, I've never had a problem finding or creating a level surface. The reason I finally settled on the Pocket Rocket (later, Micro Rocket) was that I didn't have to fiddle with the stabilizer. I've never lost a pot to lack of level. (There was that one time, though, where the right hand literally didn't know what the left hand was doing...)

Top
#171773 - 11/10/12 01:36 AM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: oldranger]
lori Offline
member

Registered: 01/22/08
Posts: 2801
My problems with the original Pocket Rocket were legion. I never figured out why people even bothered with it. Some trips the water never boiled at all, sometimes the stove just went out inexplicably at the slightest breeze. One of the supports warped and then the pot sat lopsided on the stove, wiggling at the slightest movement. Another support got so loose that it flopped around instead of staying folded. Sad that I used it for just one year, and was not going out every single month as I do now, and still had all kinds of issues with it. I replaced it with a Snowpeak Giga and have had zero problems.

Of course, then I started with alcohol stoves, and now have a big box full of those. But canister stoves are useful when the fire bans descend.

I don't think I've ever felt the need for a stabilizer from the store. If I need to level something, rocks or chunks of wood or sticks fill the bill nicely.
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki

http://hikeandbackpack.com

Top
#171780 - 11/10/12 06:46 AM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: lori]
GrumpyGord Offline
member

Registered: 01/05/02
Posts: 862
Loc: Michigan
What we have here is a solution in search of a problem.

[quote=lori

I don't think I've ever felt the need for a stabilizer from the store. If I need to level something, rocks or chunks of wood or sticks fill the bill nicely. [/quote]

Top
#171819 - 11/10/12 11:02 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: lori]
oldranger Offline
member

Registered: 02/23/07
Posts: 1735
Loc: California (southern)
I think I ordered a PR the first month they were available from REI; it is still in use on a regular basis. No problems at all. It's probably preferential treatment given to REI members with low memberships numbers.....

Top
#171840 - 11/11/12 11:27 AM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: oldranger]
billstephenson Offline
Moderator

Registered: 02/07/07
Posts: 3889
Loc: Ozark Mountains in SW Missouri
Originally Posted By oldranger
I think I ordered a PR the first month they were available from REI; it is still in use on a regular basis. No problems at all. It's probably preferential treatment given to REI members with low memberships numbers.....


I'm sure you're right. I wonder how much you could get for that number on eBay wink
_________________________
--

"You want to go where?"



Top
#171851 - 11/11/12 07:04 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: GrumpyGord]
llamero Offline
member

Registered: 10/29/12
Posts: 43
Loc: western Oregon
I used to set my stove on the ground, then I upgraded to using a bucket out of a pannier. Several years ago I built this elevated stabilization platform from scraps out of my shop. I call it "the table". laugh The llamas don't mind carrying it-weighs about 2 pounds. Plus, the plywood pieces fit into a pannier, keeping the sides flat. Llamas and tables and big meals in the back-country are not for everyone, but I like it.

Top
#171892 - 11/12/12 05:50 PM Is your backpacking stove unstable? Nope [Re: Racoon]
Richard Cullip Offline
member

Registered: 11/10/12
Posts: 16
Loc: Poway, CA
So far so good. Mine seems stable. Been using it for two years now and haven't spilled it yet. Evernew 900ml Ultralight Ti pot (wide version), Fancee Feest stove (alcohol) from Zelph Stoveworks and a home made Ti cone






Sweet and simple. It does what I need it to do - boil a bit a water for my evening meals.
_________________________
Life is good. Eternal life is better!
Richard

Top
#171896 - 11/12/12 07:50 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: billstephenson]
BZH Offline
member

Registered: 01/26/11
Posts: 848
Loc: Torrance, CA
Originally Posted By billstephenson
I'm going to offer that you might consider focusing on the popular "DYI" stoves used by a lot of backpackers.

Google "Pop can stove", "Penny Stove", "Supercat stove", "homemade alcohol stove" to get started learning about them.

These might benefit from a well designed stand, especially one that's easily made by the user. Besides added stability, some of these stoves also have another problem that could be solved with a stand. When it's cold they can be harder to light and could benefit from some insulation between them and the cold ground, maybe a way to warn the fuel too.

Let us know what you come up with!


I agree with Bill! Those DIY stove can be unstable and when they tip over, the fuel spills out. If my memory serves me there was a major California fire that was started by a bakpacker on the PCT doing just that.

Top
#171899 - 11/12/12 08:22 PM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: BZH]
OregonMouse Offline
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6400
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
Also one in Colorado last spring.
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

Top
#171909 - 11/13/12 09:35 AM Re: Is your backpacking stove unstable? [Re: OregonMouse]
Tobi Offline
member

Registered: 11/09/12
Posts: 24
Loc: Buffalo, NY, U.S.
It is important to note that the survey says, "Are you familiar with the type of backpacking stove pictured above?"

It was a picture given so that you could have a general idea of the type of product to which we were referring. We picked this stove to display because the base it has is a good example.


Edited by Tobi (11/13/12 09:38 AM)

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >

Shout Box

Highest Quality Lightweight Down Sleeping Bags
 
Western Mountaineering Sleeping Bags
 
Lite Gear Talk - Featured Topics
Knife, Fire Starter, Ignition Source
by Jim M
12/11/17 07:34 PM
Bivvy bag with wired peak
by Petro1234
12/10/17 01:06 PM
How cheap can you go?
by EMT Dave
12/05/17 07:07 PM
Backcountry Discussion - Featured Topics
Greetings - and a question
by valongi
12/11/17 11:35 AM
Just found out about UCO candles
by toddfw2003
11/30/17 08:41 AM
Hitting the eagle rock loop, Ark in 3 days
by toddfw2003
11/19/17 11:31 AM
Make Your Own Gear - Featured Topics
Plant based insulation...
by billstephenson
11/18/17 02:58 PM
lightest grommets to use
by toddfw2003
10/22/17 06:13 PM
avalibility of thin ti rod
by the-gr8t-waldo
01/26/17 04:45 PM
Featured Photos
Breakneck Ridge, New York
May 2012 Eclipse, Lassen Park
New Years Eve 2011
Trip Report with Photos
Seven Devils, Idaho
Oat Hill Mine Trail 2012
Dark Canyon - Utah
Who's Online
0 registered (), 34 Guests and 0 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
valongi, Atkinson J, Dcarpenter, Woodland, ultralight
12469 Registered Users
Forum Links
Disclaimer
Policies
Site Links
HOME
Backpacking.net
Family Hiking
Lightweight Gear Store
Backpacking Book Store
Lightweight Zone
Hiking Essentials

Outdoor Gear Daily Deals
Outlets, Sales, Bargains

Our long-time Sponsor, BackcountryGear.com - The leading source for ultralite/lightweight outdoor gear:

Backcountry Forum
 
 

Since 1996 - the Original Backcountry Forum
Copyright © The Lightweight Backpacker & BackcountryForum.com