It is acutually raining in San Diego today. Not hard yet, just a constant drizzle. When Tica and I went for our 8 miler today, I just wore a wool T and shorts. Came back soaked, but by doing this I have accumulated a body of knowledge about how I respond to stress. In this case being wet.

When it is dumping and cold I wear my backpacking rain gear and test it out. I hike hard generally, and to date have not found any gortex system that has kept me bone dry. It has kept me warm and damp though. This can be enough though. As long as you can get through the slow cautious sections along your path and stay warm enough, when you get to camp you can focus on setting up a dry area and change into dry clothes again. This has worked for me in terms of avoiding sever cases of hypothermia.

Who else gets out in all conditions to test out his or her setup?

I'm not sure I do it to test the set up, but we certainly have hiked in rain and other unpleasant conditions. And yes, even with Gore-tex, I get to choose between wet with rain or wet with condensation. Can't say there is a big advantage either way, but I will say that it's really important to get into some warm and dry clothes once you stop hiking...

Balzaccom, its easier to take the abuse if you are coming home as opposed to setting up a camp at the end of the day. Going out for 2 hours as opposed to all day is only an approximation of backpacking in the rain. But it still helps me dial stuff in and I have to take her (the dog) out anyway. Tomorrow is supposed to dump down here. If so, I'm ready with my heavy mountaineering gators. It's always fun, except for the part where I have to give the dog a cleaning outside in the rain. Today, it was a muddy mess; still a good day to wear gators to keep the crud out of your shoes/boots.

Actually, I rather *enjoy* setting up camp at the end of the day when I've been doused all day... Even without a fire, putting up some shelter or a hammock, shucking off wet or moist stuff, and putting on my sleeping underwear that's nice and dry.. maybe having a cup of tea and being out of the wind.. heck that's as good as it gets

Hiking in the rain depends on if it is warm-wet, cold-wet, and the likely duration of the poor weather and your trip. In the Sierra you can generally dry out within a day or so after getting wet; in the PNW or Rockies, you may be in for a stretch of wet weather for a week during which you cannot easily dry out. I have done days of "warm-wet" on the coast and it was simply a matter of being soggy- not particulary cold since I had wool underlayers. In this case I just kept hiking in the rain, wrung out wet stuff and kept one set of dry clothes for sleeping. I have also done weeks of "cold wet" with mix of sleet, snow and rain. In that case I hunkered down during the worst and quickly hiked from point to point during the less wet (drizzly or just cloudy) periods. In a heavy cold rain, in a remote area, it is safest to ride it out inside your tent.

My most serious cold-wet backpacking has been done in a fairly large group where the group effort was needed to survive. We delegated tasks to fire-building (not easy) and had extra clothing to share for those who got all their clothing soaked. We had 28 days of straight wet snow and sleet (June in Wyoming)! We also had to post-hole through thigh deep snow when walking. The entire ordeal was filmed (an ALCOA hour special on NOLS) and aired in 1970. A friend gave me a copy of the TV show and when I watch it, all I can say is "Oh my gosh, did I really do that!" I can definitely say that I would rather be in a larger group when I get into these condtions.

Are you famous on youtube?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7HuOOQrEZA

Some folks look pretty wet there about 45 minutes in

You really are a northerner, playing around in the snow and wet and loving it. I have done that, and enjoyed it, but it's never been "as good as it gets" for me. I love to swim, but I don't like wet cloths at all, and "cold wet" is the worst, I really don't like that.

I do agree though, getting into dry clothes is about as luxurious as anything I can imagine after a day of being wet and cold. A fire would top it off, but I'd take the dry clothes first. It's not that easy to dry clothes out with a fire when it's cold and damp or misting. I've roasted a few socks trying

You know.... If you made a "Baker's Oven" with one of those emergency blankets you might have a pretty good clothes dryer. You could rig it to use solar and it might dry out clothes a lot faster than just the sun by itself. I know it would with a fire, but I think it would using solar too. It'd be worth trying if you carry one anyway and need to dry stuff out.

If it is one day, I know what you mean. And in the Sierra Nevada Mountains (w/respect to balazccom) you usually have time to dry out. But on my 5th backpacking trip I had an experience that forever changed the way I think about this stuff. I was 11 years old and in the boy scouts. I had done one trip with my mom and dad when I was 10. Once I joined the scouts, the troup was planning for a 73 mile hike over 7 days that went by Reds Meadows and ending up at Tuolumne Meadows. Over 10 miles a day average. We did 3 weekend practice backpacks to work out bugs with tents, cooking, you know ... all the basics.

It was at the end of June 1967 and of the 7 days on trail, it rained most of the first 5 days. On the third day I remember it dumping rain with intense lightning below, to the side, and above us, and where we were we had to keep moving. We had to cross very swollen creeks brown with sediment. I was constantly soaked, in jeans, and sometimes walking up to my hips in water. Every night, we set up camp and the sky would ease up and give us a bit of sunset while we set up our tents and the dads put up tarps for us to cook under or near. Sometimes it wouldn't rain again till the next day. Sometimes it dumped again for what seemed like hours at night. Sometimes the mornings would be nice, only to get hammered again by noon. By the time we got to Thousand Island Lake, the bottom 4th of my down bag was soaked. Every chance we got along the way, we would stop to dry something critical out. I watched others try to dry their (leather) boots by the fire, only to have to slice them up the next day to get them to fit comfortably. On the 6th day, it eased up on us. I remember a whole lot more. But, basically we all survived it and learned a lot. I got my first view of the Ritter Range, which would later occupy much of my time over a 5 year period. This trip got me hooked on backpacking somehow; I think of it as a great trip.

But the big thing I learned was to not take weather in the mountains for granted. So far my paranoia about that seems to have served me well.

Good find on the video! That is some great stuff Phat.

What an ordeal! Yet, its a great experience at the same time; a memory you are glade you have (particularly with the large group). Getting wet and having the temps drop below freezing is the worst! I cannot imagine 28 days of it. Under those conditions if I run out of dry clothes and can't find a way to dry them out, I'm out of there!



THAT is a great idea! I'll have to remember that.

Oh I don't go out of my way to get wet and miserable, and don't kid yourself, I find "challenging" weather as challenging as the next guy, It's just that I know as long as I've kept my backpack in it's usual condition, which means my sleeping bag and sleeping clothing are in good shape, I guess I've just done it enough that I know pretty much no matter what mother nature is throwing at me I can get my shelter up and my dry stuff on and then I've made my own little piece of heaven.. I.E. I just don't dread the having to camp in bad weather, as long as I've got what I normally have with me.

The movie about NOLS that I was in was shot in 1969 (a different movie) and was done by professionals. It showed on TV the Alcoa Hour as "30 Days to Survival". My part was quite small- I am the one in the pigtails in the few minute climbing shot. The movie was a widely seen and the following summer of 1970 we had a record enrollment and the school has grown greatly since. In 1969 all we had were six courses- three wilderness course and three mountaineering courses (I taught in the mountaineering courses). Now NOLS is world wide with hundreds of courses. That 35-day course was absolutely the worst weather I have ever been in continuously. We ran really low on food and our burried cache (allowed in those days) had been damaged by water leakage. We ate nothing but oatmeal and Crisco for a week before our 4-day survival. We all thought we had been through enough "survival" and wanted to skip official survival and make up four more days of climbing (the weather had basically defeated all our climbing goals). But the higher ups said no, and we still had to walk out 4 days, 50 miles with no food, starting out in a half starved condition.

That movie clip was fun to watch. Brought back memories, even though I was not in it.

My first jungle hike, hot and wet: Thaïland, a long time ago. Non stop rain, from tolerable to torrential. A few minutes under a poncho, then in Tshirt, drenched anyway, with a cap, hat or bandanna to keep water out of the eyes. Disgusting, but fun (multi-days on Siberut Island in some of the same conditions was much more challenging...)

Cold and wet: plenty in the UK, Canada, Alaska, and at home. I've been soaked and miserable enough...but managed to keep my critical gear dry most of the time.

There no small pleasure more intense than to be nested in a warm, dry and cosy sleeping bag under a trusted tent or tarp, listening to the raindrops drumming around.
Unless it has been for hours or days, sitting there waiting, or when natures calls...

For those interested enough to look, the new Dry-Q fabric from Mountain Hardware looks to be incredible. It transfers moisture out so fast they they have been able to do away with pit zips and other venting.

Ueli Steck wears the stuff while training for his insane RUNS up mountains like the Matterhorn. He made it up the north face in about 2.5 hours. You can watch all about it on the youtube.

I am off to watch the video that Phat linked to in this thread.