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#136028 - 07/10/10 04:10 PM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: ghdfans2010]
CWF Offline
member

Registered: 08/22/06
Posts: 266
Ryan Jordan takes a bivy without a tarp all the time. He will but the head end under a large pine tree and keep that area dry.

As do climbers.


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#136033 - 07/10/10 07:53 PM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: gregpphoto]
chimpac Offline
member

Registered: 04/06/09
Posts: 148
Loc: alberta,can.
The only reason I would carry a bivy is to keep out flying, crawling, biting bugs.
If these bugs are not a problem a tarp does the keeping dry, cool or warm part very well.
So then why not take a bug proof tent? ans. Doors are open to much and tent gets full of mosquitos and it is a full time job killing them. A tent has walls and is to hot in summer.

A tarp can keep the rain and sun off in summer and is cooler than a tent.


Edited by chimpac (07/10/10 08:29 PM)

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#136045 - 07/11/10 11:06 AM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: CWF]
OregonMouse Offline
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6372
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
Currently Ryan Jordan uses a custom (cuben fiber) version of the Lightheart Solo tent, as shown on his blog. The previous shelters shown on his blog have been floorless pyramids. I looked at several of his gear lists on Backpacking Light and the lists in his book, "Lightweight Backpacking and Camping." Even his "SUL" (under 5 lb. base weight) lists include a tarp or a poncho tarp and a Momentum/Silnylon (water repellent, not waterproof) bivy. I am curious where you found a list of his that uses a stand-alone (waterproof) bivy. Certainly the combination of a lightweight tarp and a water repellent bivy is lighter than most stand-alone, waterproof bivies!


Edited by OregonMouse (07/11/10 11:07 AM)
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#136054 - 07/11/10 01:17 PM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: OregonMouse]
Jimshaw Offline
member

Registered: 10/22/03
Posts: 3938
Loc: Bend, Oregon
This is sort of late but - I see absolutely no reason to carry a bivy with a tarp unless you carry the bivy to keep bugs off you and a square yard or two of mosquito net will do that and weigh only an ounce. Also, sewing some mosquito net to the ends of a tarp will keep bugs out and if you like, make a short mosquito net "skirt" around the bottom so you cacn raise the sides too for ventilation. No need for zippers, just make the bottom loose to crawl under and weigh it down with gear when inside.
Jim
_________________________
These are my own opinions based on wisdom earned through many wrong decisions. Your mileage may vary.

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#136058 - 07/11/10 03:02 PM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: Jimshaw]
aimless Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 2838
Loc: Portland, OR
If nothing else, this thread proves that there's more than one way to skin a cat.

Of course, some ways of skinning it work better than others, and what you think of as "better" depends on whether you prefer to end up with a really nice, neat cat skin, or if you just want to get the job over as quick as possible. grin

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#136067 - 07/11/10 05:42 PM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: aimless]
OregonMouse Offline
member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 6372
Loc: Gateway to Columbia Gorge
OK, I'm a tenter, not a tarper (at least in bug season). I think the reason the BPL folks take a bivy (really just a bag cover) is because they take little tiny tarps so need something to keep the splash off their sleeping bags. Certainly if I took my 8 x 10 foot tarp, I wouldn't need a bivy!
_________________________
May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view--E. Abbey

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#136072 - 07/11/10 07:59 PM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: gregpphoto]
chimpac Offline
member

Registered: 04/06/09
Posts: 148
Loc: alberta,can.
Yes a net keeps the mosquitos from biting but is nice to have an aparatus to keep it off your skin.You can hang it some way or carry some light poles for hoops. Is there any other way to do it?
Most sleeping pads and bags should be on a waterproof ground sheet. So now that is half a bivy.
If you sew in a pocket on the ground sheet to slip the bottom half of the sleeping bag and pad into, then you will not slip of the pad. Then put in another pocket to put what ever you use for a pillow into.
All that is left to do is put in some zippers to join the net to the ground sheet to keep out the ants and other crawling things. One thing leads to another all the time adding weight and more stuff.
I have got an expensive bivy but it is hot and does not breath good enough. To stay cool in hot summer, an all net tunnel bivy would be nice.


Edited by chimpac (07/11/10 08:20 PM)

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#136074 - 07/11/10 08:46 PM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: OregonMouse]
CWF Offline
member

Registered: 08/22/06
Posts: 266
Ryan is testing the Lightheart for BPL. He doesn't own it.

In any event, here are just a few quotes from Ryan himself regarding bivvies:

"However, consider the advantages of a bivy sack like the Unishelter: absolute simplicity in pitching and the emotive rewards of sleeping under the stars while remaining protected. My favorite feature about the Unishelter is the ability to remain warm and dry, securely cocooned inside the shelter, reading a good adventure story or writing in my journal, while a storm rages only inches from my head! It brings you in closer communion with nature's fury and makes you appreciate it in a more intimate way. The experience is capped by waking to clear skies, unzipping the door, sitting up, and brewing morning coffee while snapping photographs of the sunrise. "

"The eVENT floor of the Overbag/Bivy allowed me to flip the bivy over when using it as a standalone shelter in driving snow and rain. This allowed me keep the hood opening facing downward and protected from moisture entry. I was not able to do this with the Micro Bivy, because its coated floor would have resulted in prodigious accumulation of moisture in the bivy resulting from condensation."

"Below treeline, with the Micro Bivy, I simply moved my pitch so that the head end of my bivy was protected under the shelter of a tree or bush."

"For years, ultralight backpackers have scoffed at bivy sacks, claiming that outrageous psychological disorders will afflict the occupant. "Claustrophobia!" says one. "Modern day sweat lodge!" says another. Still others punch their calculators and thus deduce that bivy sacks offer space-to-weight ratios that, given the state of modern-day ultralight shelters, are as outdated as their HP-35's.

But what of it?

The bivy sack, in its purest form, provides a weatherproof shelter with a simplicity that has yet to be benchmarked by another design. Only in a bivy sack can you lie in the warmth of your sleeping bag and watch a meteor shower while being protected from wind and dew. Only in a bivy sack can you roll over in the morning, open one eye, and get a horizon-to-horizon overhead view of a magical sunrise. And only in a bivy sack can you arrive in camp, crawl in, and go to sleep: no stakes, no guylines, no poles, and no "good pitch" to survey."

"Now, I'm down to three shelters that I actually use on a regular basis:

A small bivy tent (my current favorite is the Nemo GoGo, at 1.9 lbs)."

Here is a picture and discussion around his ID Micro-Bivy:

http://www.ryanjordan.com/weblog/2009/07/pine-tree-bivouac.html

Note that all of these comments are for waterproof bivvies without a tarp.





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#136075 - 07/11/10 08:53 PM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: CWF]
DTape Offline
member

Registered: 11/23/07
Posts: 654
Loc: Upstate NY
overhead sunrise watching? I watch the sunrise by turning my head (usually to my left) and peer through the bugnetting of my hammock. It is funny, all of those "benefits" he describes I appreciate fully with my hammock. HYOH
_________________________
http://ducttapeadk.blogspot.com

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#136081 - 07/11/10 11:15 PM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: DTape]
CWF Offline
member

Registered: 08/22/06
Posts: 266
Especially where there are no trees, eh?

Honestly, leave the hammock baiting to another forum. This is about bivvies.

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#136091 - 07/12/10 03:46 AM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: CWF]
ghdfans2010 Offline
newbie

Registered: 07/10/10
Posts: 3
Loc: VA
This is sort of late but - I see absolutely no reason to carry a bivy with a tarp.Do you think so?

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#136095 - 07/12/10 10:58 AM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: Jimshaw]
DJ2 Offline
member

Registered: 01/06/02
Posts: 1347
Loc: Seattle, WA
I would use a bivy under a tarp for added warmth.

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#136106 - 07/12/10 01:44 PM Re: Two serious bivy questions [Re: gregpphoto]
Trailrunner Offline
member

Registered: 01/05/02
Posts: 1835
Loc: Los Angeles
Clearly there are as many opinions on this subject as there are hikers. The important thing is to go out there, experiment, and find out what works for YOU.
_________________________
If you only travel on sunny days you will never reach your destination.*

* May not apply at certain latitudes in Canada and elsewhere.

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