I know I'm not "ultra light" yet, but I'm hoping you guys are the ones that can help me get going in that direction.
I'm somewhat new to backpacking, and after a few trips, I'm trying to figure out how to shave some weight. I mostly backpack with my wife, so the load is split. I take the tent and fishing gear, and she takes the bear can and food.
Our last trip I was carrying roughly 37lbs. while she was carrying roughly 32lbs. These weights were measured using a not so accurate fish scale.
Recently I bought a postal scale and weighed everything that I take on a trip down to the ounce. You will see next to some of the items that I have listed what I would like to replace it with to save some weight, but with the listed replacements, I would only save about 6lbs. For solo trips I would like to get my complete weight down to 30lbs. or less minus food but including water. So forget that I'm splitting weight with my wife.
I know the first suggestions will be aimed at the pack and my sleeping bag. Well, the pack is a bit heavy, but it makes the load FEEL a lot lighter. I'd rather carry the extra pound if it makes it feel like I'm carrying 5lbs. less. The sleeping bag, well, I'm a cold sleeper. I had a 20F bag, but I was cold at 35F, so I gotta keep warm, plus I just bought it and the wife would freak if I got rid of it, and it should be comfortable for early winter trips.
Other than that, what are your thoughts? How do I compare with you all's weights? Remember this includes water! But not food.
Hi, and welcome aboard. I'm impressed when people just show up and post a gear list. I'm still working on lightweight too, it's very much a work in progress.
Just glanced at your profile - we hike the same mountains, cool.
My general comments, to start:
Choose between the steripen and the filter. If you are not going where viruses are a concern, which you aren't in the Sierras, either will work - though I have heard of steripen issues that would make me less likely to choose that, myself. Take Micropur tablets as a backup to whichever you choose, as filters clog and batteries fail. I've filtered from sources that looked dicey enough that I used both.
You can chop off some weight with a different tent - a Clip Flashlight would shave some off, a Tarptent would shave off more. Still more could be saved if you went with a tarp and groundcloth. Looks like you're interested in a Mid, those are good too - think I saw a used one for sale either here or at backpackinglight.com. I'm guessing you use the tarp for a kitchen shelter - you could pick up a poncho/shelter to swap for the rain jacket and have a dual use item for that purpose.
Three liters is a bit much for a day's hiking, unless you are going out in the desert. I usually find two is enough unless it is very hot. In the Sierras there's usually plenty of water to filter if you run out on the way.
What is in the first aid kit? I think mine, for hiking with a large group of casual hikers, weighs maybe 8 oz at the worst. And I pack everything including the tick puller.
I have a plastic trowel - I rarely take it anymore. A heel or a rock or a stick will work in most cases, but then, I'm not hiking around in hardpan. A tent stake (if you have a Y stake or something similar, needle stakes are less useful) will work too.
I know, the bag - but a high quality down bag will shave the weight in half and probably be warmer. It's a simple enough matter to keep a down bag dry in the mountains. I wonder if you are a cold sleeper, or if it's just the bag isn't accurately rated. I thought I was a cold sleeper until I got an accurately rated down quilt - it was absolutely spot on, rated 25F and I finally slept out with it in 25F weather - I was just warm enough to be comfortable but not toasty like usual. I had no idea the temp got so low until we got up and the digital thermometer stored the lowest night temp - plus the snow on the ground was a kick in the pants.
The other potential spot to shave ounces would be the bear can - the Bearikade would lighten you up some more, but at a hefty price.
The NeoAir was okay for me down to 25F, but colder and I would add a foam pad to it. FYI. Of course, you already have a foam pad...
The other thing - what are you taking for food? Dehydrate/rehydrate or fresh?
_________________________
"In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's mind there are few." Shunryu Suzuki
You've come to the right place. Time for some tough luv
The tent, pack and sleeping bag need review for replacement, probably in that order (cut the pack after you've worked on the other big items so you can size it correctly). You have a filter plus UV. Pick one (probably UV plus a simple prefilter). You somehow have found a one pound spinning reel and in any case, can do with just the fly reel. Nalgene bottles are always overkill and can be replaced by reused lightweight drink containers from the store.
Only take the bear canister where required, otherwise learn tree hanging or consider an Ursack.
You can cut the rain jacket weight in half and your insulated jacket as well.
You've done well in a lot of other areas, your kitchen for example, so you're probably closer than you might think. Beginning with the tent, there's an easy ten pounds to shed without breaking a sweat. The next five will require more creativity, then voila, you're home free.
#122039 - 10/08/0912:02 AMRe: Help me trim the fat out of my gear list
[Re: stingray4540]
phat Moderator
Registered: 06/24/07
Posts: 4107
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Let's see:
Backpack - 69 oz is heavy, but again I'd change this last - there are lots of other lighter options.
Tent - you're obviously already thinking about it. Also consider tarptent or smd lunar solo to be below the 30 oz mark.
+10 sleeping bag - you carry that year round? I live in the great white freaking north and much of backpacking season I carry a -3 rated bag - realisticly abotu 28 degrees. going to a down bag that is lighter and rated closer to temps you will actually see will save you weight. keep the +10 for colder conditions, and carry it then, but 41 oz is a fairly heavy bag.
8x10 tarp - a tarp *and* a tent? I carry one of these for a hammock tarp when hammocking. I don't carry an 8x10 tarp when carrying a tent. Consider getting a small 5x8, or something like an integral designs silponcho, which is a 5x8 tarp that also makes good raingear and packcover. You can then rig that as your sit under it in camp tarp if you need to.
Ditch the nalgene, and buy a platypus, or take a used 1L pop bottle. - there's at least 4-5 oz
*sponge* - I'm baffled. what on earth for. ditch it. I wash my pots with rocks and sand - or typically not at all because I'm only boiling water.
Jacket - *and* a rain jacket. Pick an outer water/windproof layer and a good insultor or two. You're not too bad on weight here but you may want to consider it. change this slowly to get clothing combinations you are comfortable with and work for you.
The pack rain cover could be replaced with the above mentioned silponcho which would also be your tarp - and your rainwear.
Shovel? bah.. dig cat hole with stick.
I live in mosquito heaven and have never taken a quarter pound of bug juice.. find 100% deet and take a small container - if you want to not use 100% cut it with water in the field.
towel? well, I don't - i use my shirt, or nothing.
a 20 oz first aid kit eh? Well, be sure that's all realistic stuff that you can and *will* use and you are trained for. My first aid kit *AND* my PLB together weigh 20oz. My first aid kit hits likely scenarios. (minor cuts, blisters, abrasions, etc.) - for serious stuff like broken bones forget the sam splint sillyness. - I press the button and wait for helicopter to come.
Hope you are doing a *lot* of fishing with a pound of spinning reel, *and* a fly reel - this is realistic if your primary purpose is to get out and fish, and I totally get that because I do trips like that. If not, and you're occasionally fishing, think about cutting back to just fly or spin alone.
Ditch the steripen and filter and carry aquamira (Chlorine dioxide). fast and effective, a lot lighter than either of the others.
You've gotten great advice from everyone. If you need a Nalgene for your filter or convenience, switch to the milky white ones and save several ounces over the hard ones. I'll add to the comments on your insulation layer; a fleece pullover is 1lb or less, a primaloft jacket from Patagonia or Montbell is around 12oz, or a down sweater from Montbell or Patagonia is under 10oz. Pick one and replace your compressor. For 20 oz, I carry a down jacket that is good down around 15F or lower depending on what else I am wearing. The lighter layers keep me warm (I get really cold if I'm not moving) down to he mid 20's.
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If I wouldn't eat it at home, why would I want to eat it on the trail?
Great advice from every one, if you are going to be doing some solo then a new tent would be a much needed purchase, you have alot of choices for solo tents down under three pounds. If your solo you with a tent you wont't need a tarp, a poncho or big green garbage bag would be fine. You could take almost a pound of the first aid kit. If your pack is comortable for you use it for long weekends and weeklong trips, lets face it thats a nice pack and will last forever, you could get a smaller lighter pack once you get a final gearlist together for day and overnights. You might have to do some voodoo on your wife and get a lighter bag, you can get a much lighter bag thats not only light and warm but packs down much better, down is awesome.
_________________________
"In the beginers mind there are many possibilities, but in the expert's there are few." Shunryu Suzuki
Alright, thanks for all the help so far guys! You got me thinking about some stuff I haven't thought of before.
But, it looks like I got some 'splanning to do. See my BLUE comments below:
Originally Posted By lori
Just glanced at your profile - we hike the same mountains, cool.
My general comments, to start:
Choose between the steripen and the filter. If you are not going where viruses are a concern, which you aren't in the Sierras, either will work - though I have heard of steripen issues that would make me less likely to choose that, myself. Take Micropur tablets as a backup to whichever you choose, as filters clog and batteries fail. I've filtered from sources that looked dicey enough that I used both.
My only concern with tabs, is the taste. Remember I do most of my hiking with my wife, and I'm somewhat of a water snob as she would say. Also, I'm super perinoid about getting sick when I'm in the wilderness. I'm helpless when I'm sick... I suppose you're right about the Sierra's, I can probably ditch the steripen, but I also do a lot of Bay Area trips, which usually have livestock nearby. Maybe I'll save the steripen for those trips? or switch to tabs if someone can confirm they don't make your water tast like crap?
Three liters is a bit much for a day's hiking, unless you are going out in the desert. I usually find two is enough unless it is very hot. In the Sierras there's usually plenty of water to filter if you run out on the way.
Well, I drink A LOT. Our last trip was only 6 miles to the lake, and we both almost ran out by the time we got there, and on the way back, I ran dry had to sip off my wife's. So, I'm not sure if I could afford to cut back on that, plus I don't trust water sources I see on a map, our last trip showed 4-5 streams we would be crossing, and only one had any water in it.
I have a plastic trowel - I rarely take it anymore. A heel or a rock or a stick will work in most cases, but then, I'm not hiking around in hardpan. A tent stake (if you have a Y stake or something similar, needle stakes are less useful) will work too.
Ditching the shovel completely is a possibility. I never thought about it, but I would have to clear it with the wife as she is the one who uses the restroom the most when we are out. It did come in handy though digging trenches around our tents in the torrential downpour we got caught in in Big Basin
I know, the bag - but a high quality down bag will shave the weight in half and probably be warmer. It's a simple enough matter to keep a down bag dry in the mountains. I wonder if you are a cold sleeper, or if it's just the bag isn't accurately rated. I thought I was a cold sleeper until I got an accurately rated down quilt - it was absolutely spot on, rated 25F and I finally slept out with it in 25F weather - I was just warm enough to be comfortable but not toasty like usual. I had no idea the temp got so low until we got up and the digital thermometer stored the lowest night temp - plus the snow on the ground was a kick in the pants.
My bag is a down bag, and I haven't taken it down to it's rating yet, but as I can't afford two bags, this one should allow me to do some early and late winter trips as well. But I will keep that in mind once I've put a couple years on this one, it's brand new and my wife barely allowed the money to be spent on it in the first place... Maybe by next summer, I can start looking for a summer bag/quilt
The other potential spot to shave ounces would be the bear can - the Bearikade would lighten you up some more, but at a hefty price.
Ah yes, my budy has one of those, but I don't think I could justify the price to my wife
The other thing - what are you taking for food? Dehydrate/rehydrate or fresh?
Instant oatmeal for breakfast(naturally dehydrated), and dehydrated dinners, and usually cliff bars, or trailmix or jerky for lunch.
Originally Posted By phat
Let's see:
8x10 tarp - a tarp *and* a tent? I carry one of these for a hammock tarp when hammocking. I don't carry an 8x10 tarp when carrying a tent. Consider getting a small 5x8, or something like an integral designs silponcho, which is a 5x8 tarp that also makes good raingear and packcover. You can then rig that as your sit under it in camp tarp if you need to.
Well, the reason I carry a tarp, is because it came in real handy in the rainstorm we had on one of our trips. We set up the tarp, then set up our tents underneath it, and moved them out, so the tents didn't get wet while they were being pitched, plus we had an area for all 4 of us the spend the rest of the evening and the next morning. If I got the mid though, I would probably leave the tarp at home since the tent will have so much room. Unless we are going with another couple.
Ditch the nalgene, and buy a platypus, or take a used 1L pop bottle. - there's at least 4-5 oz
Well, the Nalgene is for treating water with the steripen, not so much for drinking out of. But someone mentioned milky white bottles that weigh less, so that might be an alternitive. Also, I will likely ditch the steripen when in the Sierras so the nalgene will go with it.
*sponge* - I'm baffled. what on earth for. ditch it. I wash my pots with rocks and sand - or typically not at all because I'm only boiling water.
Well, it's only a .5" by 2" piece of sponge, so it's weight is negligible I think. But I'll try to do without it on the next few trips and if I don't use it I'll stop bringing it.
Jacket - *and* a rain jacket. Pick an outer water/windproof layer and a good insultor or two. You're not too bad on weight here but you may want to consider it. change this slowly to get clothing combinations you are comfortable with and work for you.
Well, so far I am pretty comfortable with this, but in the future, I'll keep an eye out for better options. Someone else mentioned the montebell down jacket for example.
The pack rain cover could be replaced with the above mentioned silponcho which would also be your tarp - and your rainwear.
I've come across this approach in my browsing, but personally decided against it, because I can't see how you transition from poncho to tarp without getting soaked. Thanks for the input, but I can't see myself doing this one.
I live in mosquito heaven and have never taken a quarter pound of bug juice.. find 100% deet and take a small container - if you want to not use 100% cut it with water in the field.
Do you put it in a small spray container, or how do you apply it? I agree, it's a pretty big bottle, more than 2 of us would need in one trip.
towel? well, I don't - i use my shirt, or nothing.
Well, I use this mostly for drying the condensation off my tent fly before packing it. And also I like the idea of being able to dry myself off in case I fell in the lake or stream for some reason.
a 20 oz first aid kit eh? Well, be sure that's all realistic stuff that you can and *will* use and you are trained for. My first aid kit *AND* my PLB together weigh 20oz. My first aid kit hits likely scenarios. (minor cuts, blisters, abrasions, etc.) - for serious stuff like broken bones forget the sam splint sillyness. - I press the button and wait for helicopter to come.
Well I don't have a locator beacon, so my first aid kit also contains my survival kit. Mostly signalling stuff, like a whistle, small mirror, glow stick, SAK. I don't have stuff like splints etc. Only basic stuff I know I know how to use. I have been meaning to go through it again as it was originally designed for day hikes and getting through an unexpected night out. So, I can probably make a seperate one for backpacking that will help save some ounces.
Hope you are doing a *lot* of fishing with a pound of spinning reel, *and* a fly reel - this is realistic if your primary purpose is to get out and fish, and I totally get that because I do trips like that. If not, and you're occasionally fishing, think about cutting back to just fly or spin alone.
Well, my first and true passion in life is fishing. But I will probably limit my tackle to fly fishing only, in the sierras from now on, that will save 2 - 3 pounds. Only problem is that I'm not a very good fly fisherman, or there isn't always room to cast, so it is always tempting to bring the spinning gear...
P.S. I just want to thank everyone for there insites so far. You all have given me a lot to think about. Some stuff I can do now, other stuff I'll have to consider in the next couple of years as I start to upgrade (or is it downgrade?).
If you are in a location where there is plenty of water,(eg. the Sierras) you do not need to carry any as you hike. Drink a liter before you start. Later, stop at a stream, use your steri pen, drink another liter and so on. Fill a three liter bottle in camp, use pills since it is easier to have the water in the container overnight, and you will be ready to go on the morning without having to collect any more water. Switch to a tarp for your shelter.
Yeah lose the backpack last. I suggest a tarptent, many light weight two person tents, six moon designs also makes great tents. I use both a tarptent squall and a six moon gatewood cape. I have fit three people in the sqaull2! You could also try a ray jardin type set up with a two person quilt and tarp. Stick to one type of fishing pole/reel. You don't have to spend a bunch of cash to go ultra light. Also try an alcohol stove, happy camping
I've ditched the trowel for a large tent stake that can double as...a tent stake. Worth considering if you're camping where the ground isn't too hard or rocky.
Registered: 02/26/07
Posts: 1149
Loc: Washington State, King County
Search the web for an "SMC Sand/Snow Tent Stake", for example, here. If you're too aggressive with this, it will bend, but with a little care I've dug a lot of catholes with this (and indeed, at the suggested depth). And I've occasionally used it as an auxiliary or soft earth/snow stake as well, though less than I expected when I first made this switch. Part of the trick is just remembering in camp that it's not just a cathole digger!
Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 679
Loc: Central Texas
You have taken two good steps: scales and a gear list. Well, then:
**First off, don't count supplies as base weight. Count only non-consumables. Put consumable supplies on a separate list and total everything last. Supply weight varies a lot. Gold Bond weights more in the plastic shaker bottle than it weighs in a ziploc bag. Count the Snow Peak cannister as 3.5 oz. - the weight of the empty cannister. The fuel is consumable and its weight dissappears during the hike. See, you are lighter than you thought!
**Change the pack last. Your pack is not awfully heavy and you like how it carries, so stick with it. You have plenty of other weight saving potential. It can be frustrating to find that a new pack doesn't fit your gear.
**Make things do more than one job. **Don't carry duplicates. * You could drop either the Steripen or the filter - or drop both and just use a chemical treatment. * Why carry both a tarp and a tent? The tarp with mosquito net and ground sheet will weigh about 2.5# The tent is on the heavy side. Consider 3.5# as an easy target for a tent and 2.5# as tarp weight for 2 folks with groundsheet and mosquito net. *Why carry both a fly reel and a spinning reel? Make do with one. With a little practice you dont need a reel for fly fishing.
**Look for suitable, lightweight alternatives. Your Nalgene weighs as much as four Gatoraid bottles or 6 soda bottles. * a DryDucks rain suit weighs half as much as your rain jacket and pants and works as a wind and bug suit. * Do you need a 20 ounce jacket? Why not a vest and long wool T under a W/B jacket?
*Consider the necessity of each item: * Why a Bear Vault? are you in grizz country? If not, leave the vault at home. Use a stuff sack for a "critter hang" to discourage raccoons and chipmunks.
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