On my last trip I had my first creek ford after about a week. Wearing trail running shoes, I just ploughed through, then changed to dry socks on the other side and kept going. the result - the shoes held enough water to soak my dry socks pretty quick and then I got blisters (small but troublesome) - after having had no foot problems up to that point. So I'm re-thinking my fording strategy, nad looking for input on what everyone else does. I know I could carry Crocs or water shoes, but I'm looking for lighter options. For those who have had success just ploughing through without stopping or changing socks, what kind of socks do you wear?

I take off my shoes, and go through with just socks. It works fine. Change to dry pair and your golden. If doing multiple crossings, keep putting on the wet pair to go through. If you have baby feet this might not work for you.

Sorry I don't have an answer to your specific query. I carry a cheap pair of flip flops on the back of my pack for this very reason. Just last week I came to a a 100yd beaver swamp I had to slog through knee deep. The flipflops worked great. I did have to worry a few times when I thought the muck had a good hold of them and might eat 'em up. I chuckled when I was 10 ft from the "shore" and I realized I was standing on a bridge that was a foot under water! Anyway, either go barefoot, use just socks (and change into dry) or carry some real light flipflops or sandals.

Like anything else, it depends.

If there is only one crossing I'll try to keep my feet dry. But if it's a hot day and the trail ahead is dry I find the water refreshing on my feet. Those conditions existed a couple of weeks ago when I was in SEKI and I purposely walked through part of Hamilton Lake. My feet were dry again in an hour. I use thin nylon socks and that really helps.

I'll agree that dry socks quickly become wet socks when worn under wet shoes.

If I'm facing multiple stream crossings and/or it's raining I don't even try to keep my feet dry. I think resistance is futile. If I feel a hot spot coming on I tape it with Elastikon. Great stuff. It stretches with your skin and the adhesive is waterproof. I usually leave it on for several days. Injinji socks really help too. Last year on a long hike my feet were wet all day every day for nearly 4 days and I had nary a problem.

I carry a pair of aquasocks for stream crossings. They also work well as camp shoes.

If I'm going to been in water all day, for instance the Redwood Creek trail is the creek and you're in the water 75% of the time I just wear trail runners and synthetic socks and get wet. Then switch to the wet shoes with Seal-Skin socks when I want dry feet.

Well, if there isn't a log and I don't have any spare footwear or a pair I'm willing to get wet, I just roll through it barefoot. A little slippery sometimes, but all the more reason for my to take my time.

I used to bring along a pair of shoes just for that purpose that I didn't care would get wet and just change into them at crossings. Nowadays I bring along my Merrel water shoes I bought since they tend to be work just fine to walk in, water or not, if I were to get tired of my boots.

If stream crossings (or general foot-wetting) is rare and the stream easy to cross and the water visibility allows the bottom to be seen, I might take off shoes and socks to cross, else my strategy is like yours was (Paul), except for the changing into dry socks on the other side --- just walk through, and walk the shoes (and socks) dry.

Lots of people do this, and it's not just about stream crossings, but also walking in wet weather with porous shoes.

Everyone's feet are different, so I can't comment on why you got blisters from this (assuming clear causality) and others don't. I don't, at any rate. You might look at the particular spots where you got blisters and then look at your shoes at that spot --- maybe another shoe would be a solution (?).

What kind of socks: I typically wear just a thin, quick-to-dry liner sock, such as Fox River x-static liner socks. Sometimes I wear injinji's, but most commonly a single liner sock. Of course if it's cold out, a pair of wool socks go over those; they stay wet a long time, but retain warmth.

I've used seal skinz and goretex socks. I don't find the sealskinz keep me warm enough (over wool socks) to warrant carrying them. Goretex socks are nice in snow; for rain/wet they can be okay too, but a second pair of wool socks might be a better way to spend that bit of "weight allowance".

This is really bad advice for several reasons, the primary one being that you have far less traction barefoot or in socks than you do with shoes on. Second, if you cut your foot on something sharp, you are in real trouble.

I've crossed many rivers in NZ where you had no idea what was on the bottom because you couldn't see it. I kept my boots on, crossed, squeezed the water out of my wool socks, put them back on and in about a half hour or so, they were dry. No blisters, no cuts. The only time I fell, I was carrying a 40 lb pack, but managed to get back on my feet after being on all fours. I don't think I could have gotten back up if I had been barefoot and most likely would have lost my pack.

fyi, I still have those boots and they look like someone took a box cutter to them-lots of small cuts in the leather all over them from extremely sharp rocks on river bottoms and trails.

Barry's missionary zeal converted me to sandals last year. They are great for stream crossing. I pull off my socks, put the sandals back on and cross. Then I walk for a while sans socks until my feet are reasonably dry. Then I put the socks back on, replace the sandals, and keep going.

I used to use crocs (flip flops are a similar idea) but in swift current it's easy to lose one off your foot. I sandals I don't worry about this and I have plenty of traction.

In colder weather I use sealskins and sandals to cross streams and then switch back to my wool socks on the other side. I'd use sealskins and sandals all the time but they keep my feet a bit too moist from sweat I feel. Not super bad but not good enough to wear all day.

Paul, what shoes were you wearing that didn't dry very fast? Not all trailrunners dry equally. Especially G-tex models or those with real leather.

I cross all streams with shoes on, even if there is a log.

Shoes are usually running shoes made from all synthetic materials. I wear shoes that are a size or two larger than my foot size would indicate.

Socks are thin nylon dress socks.

I've never had a blister from doing this.

My feet, socks and shoes are usually wet from sweat anyway. I find the streams refreshing.

Shoes may or may not dry later in the day, depending upon weather. It really doesn't matter to me.

I edited my post because I came off like a prick, and for that I apologize.



Traction is just simply not an issue.

You are correct, if you do step on something sharp you are in trouble. However, if you step slowly and carefully, you prevent yourself from stepping on anything that will cut you. The proof is in the pudding.

Asics Gel Trabuco. Not gore-tex, and I'd say perhaps a medium amount of leather. I don't have a wide choice of trail runners since most of them don't fit my rather wacky feet.

Traction is an issue. In creeks where the water is clear and not deep, no shoes might be fine, but in fast running rivers where you might be at least knee deep and can't see anything at all, one mistep and you can easily go over. I have a dislocated shoulder that proves how important traction is and that happened in a parking lot.

If you can't see the bottom, as I wrote, you have no idea what you are stepping on. To be honest, I couldn't care less what other people do as long as they aren't with me. I would never let anyone with me cross water with their shoes off. To me, it isn't worth the risk. I was hiking alone much of the time, so risk management was a high priority for me.

I don't mean to come across as mean spirited either, but for the conditions I was hiking in, I never saw anyone take off their boots and for good reason.

Tom, I'm pretty much in your corner when it comes to how I ford streams. I have spent a lot of my time in country where many of the streams are glacial melt water. They can be, depending on conditions, deep and fast, slow, clear as a bell or pretty murky. The footing under all this is uncertain and shifting at best: mud, silt, sand, loose cobbles, boulders etc.

Early in my mountaineering days I tried crossing barefoot or with socks. I wanted to keep my boots dry. I did this a few times, hurt my feet and fell and then decided to start crossing in whatever shoes or boots I was wearing, sans socks. Sure my boots got wet but they would have gotten wet anyway as soon as I reached the snow or glacier above.

The important thing is to protect your feet and to have good traction and footing; bare feet (or socks) do not always provide these things. Everything else is a comfort issue; safety overrides comfort every time for me.

I wear Body Glide on my feet, which repels water, and just hike thru the streams, or hike in the down pouring rain with my trail runners and Smartwool Adrenaline socks. Happened this weekennd and not one blister, or hotspot, or foot sliding around. Hiked 6 miles in heavy rain the entire time. I swear by Body Glide. Haven't tried Hydropel, but I'm sure it's just as good.

So true.

I have a video, shot last March, of a friend crossing Sespe Creek. She was in up to mid-calf and the water appeared to be benign.......until she stepped into an unseen hole and found herself up to her chest!!!!!!

hefty trash bags over your boots seems to work well, at least for water no deeper than knee deep. dont weigh much and can serve double duty as a tent footprint.

I've been trying to get a video from my friend of me crossing otter creek, water just below my butt rushing crazy after a night of thunder storms carrying my 60lb dutch sheperd on my shoulder. There was no way he would be able to cross safely and he was too scared to try it anyway. i have had to do this a few times unfortunately, not really the safest thing to do, pretty intense actually and its usually just us two on the hike. I use keen slip on sandals when crossing even in winter, I keep them strapped to my pack and use them as camp shoes as well. I think the next K9 will be a dutch retreiver haha

Paul
felt bottomed flyfishing boots with goretex waders. And a wading staff.
Jim

So I ordered a couple pair of the sprintaquatics mesh shoes, and already recieved them. 2 oz for the pair (their size 11-12 is what I ordered, but the little sticker on the shoes says 13 - they fit my size 12 feet okay), and they look like they would work out pretty well. here's another idea I found while this discussion has been going on;

http://translate.google.se/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.andersj.se&sl=sv&tl=en&hl=sv&ie=UTF-8

These or something similar would be easy to make and might be nice for colder weather.

Read Barry's posts. Sandals are great. I compromised with Salomon techamphibians. The back adjusts and optionally folds down.

Thanks Barry

“…but I'm looking for lighter options. For those who have had success just ploughing through without stopping or changing socks, what kind of socks do you wear?”

Thanks Heber and Ecrow for the kind words. When you have a piece of Heaven, you want to share it .

I’m a Teva TeraFi-2 sandal backpacker and ford streams and rivers all the time with sock and sandal. It actually feels very nice. I love open toe sandals. I just change my socks once/day. My booted backpacking buddies change once/hour in high humidity to minimize blisters. I wear thick coolmax socks during 3-season. I find them at Walmart--- Dickies have been working great. They provide nice cushion and dry fast.

This teva sandal provides great traction on wet granite rock, even at sharp angles. And they continue to amaze me as I just summited Mt. Timpanogos in UT which required a lot of scree and snow scrambling (I got off the trail). I was impressed with a few people doing this summit in their chacos. I feel Teva’s ‘spider rubber’ has a better grab than most hiking footwear out there.

Just make sure the sandal is strapped tight when you backpack. Then loosen it when stopped. It then feels like a slipper .

When the temperature gets around 25-35F, I then use a different strategy for fording rivers.

Sprintaquatics will probably work. However, when your ankle is turning on the rocks, it helps to have the footwear snug-tight in that water which I can’t see happening with sprintaquatics nylon mesh shoe.
Also, if you’re with a partner or group, I just find changing footwear really slows down the group.

Blisters are caused by heat, moisture, and friction. Minimize one of them to minimize blisters. Try to minimize two of them to eliminate blisters.

-Barry

How was Timp? I am thinking of taking my scouts up it next spring. My boss took his cubs up it a few months ago. I figure if cubs can do it, then scouts should be able to.

Barry - I would love to try sandals, but I have prescription orthotics, without which my feet hurt a lot. No sandal I have found (and I did some looking) will allow me to use my orthotics, and none has a footbed shaped anything like my orthotics. If you know of any sandals that will aloow me to use my orthotics, I'd love to hear about them.
I agree that the sprintaquatics shoes will be less than ideal, but they seem like a big step up from barefoot, and at 2 oz for the pair not much to carry. Plus being useful for recreational wading as well.
I'm also considering the idea that I just need to change to thinner socks, as it seems that the folks who are having success wading streams in their trail runners and socks and not stopping are using thinner socks than I am. so that might be the ticket, I'll have to give it a try.

Birkenstocks are the only sandals I know of with an orthotic like food bed. I think I've seen some of them made (or covered) in rubber rather than the cork and leather standard base but I don't know if you can sinch them tight.

Another resounding vote on the traction issue. I don't go barefoot or stocking feet for that reason usually.

My usual strategy is to go on through, then maybe dry my socks off by wringing them out. Typically I am wearing just a polypro liner sock, or a poly liner with a wool sock. if I wring out the wool sock effectively I tend to not have too much water after.

Oftentimes if I am just wearing a liner sock and trailrunners I don't wring them out. I just keep going. This is the primary attraction of a trailrunner to me. Wearing boots I'll usually wring out.

Given some of the responses since my last post, I am going to repeat myself. The reason I would keep my boots on is because I am often alone and I want to limit my risk of injury. If you cut up a foot, sprain an ankle or break a bone in your foot and can't walk, you will have to be rescued, either by your companion or companions, if any or if alone, by yourself. If you have a PLB, SPOT or working cel phone, you can call for help, but you will need help nonetheless.

Rescue avoidance should be first on your mind and that comes with limiting risk. However, as I also said earlier, as long as you aren't with me, do whatever you like.

“How was Timp? I am thinking of taking my scouts up it next spring.”

That was one of the funnest hikes I ever did. I am impressed that kids can do it. It is labeled ‘strenuous’. We saw two girls that were 9 yrs old going with their dad. They left about 5pm and were going to camp halfway up; then summit the next day. They’ve done it before.

We ran into one scout troop of about 9; an interesting story… thread drift here.
First a little background. We did this trip by leaving Thurs Aug 20th at 2:30pm. Our goal was Emerald lake. It took us 5 hours to go 7 miles. And it was straight up. I drank ½ gal of water throughout. My cousin and I weren’t quite used to that altitude yet and it was hard getting there. I got lost twice. The next day we got up and left Emerald at 8:30am and summited Mt. Timp. at 11:30am. That’s about 1 mile/hour. It got steeper the closer you got. We followed the trail. On the way down, we were told we could save an hour by going across the north-side snow bank (not going down the ‘glacier’). We did. That was fun and it only took us 2 hours from the summit back to Emerald Lake. At the lake, there was a scout troop of about 9 that started from the Aspen trailhead in the morning. They were huffing and puffing at the lake. One scout came to me and said “Are you the guy with the Purifier?”. Hmmm, “Yea I have a Purifier”. The scout said, “We were told you were coming and I’m real thirsty.” I really didn’t know what he was talking about. Apparently some ranger told him another ranger would be up their purifying water. I didn’t see any ranger. The scout only drank 1qt on the way up and he was dehydrated. I gave him a quart. He drank in 10 seconds. I gave him another quart. Another scout came and wanted water. I gave him some. I asked if any more scouts want water. The scout master told me they were all right now. They WERE going to summit Mt. Timp but they had no energy left. So they started descending back down. My lady cousin and I resupplied w/ water and headed down. We passed the scouts. They were hurting. I could tell some of them were going to get hammer toes with their boots. My cousin gave them some more water as we passed them. Since they were getting UV burn, my cousin gave them some sunscreen.

I loved the mountain goats (they cleaned up my camp) and the hummingbirds up there at 10K.

So my personal take is-- it’s easier to summit if you take 2 days doing it.

-Barry

“If you know of any sandals that will aloow me to use my orthotics, I'd love to hear about them.”

My wife wears orthotics in her sandals. She can’t wear them in the teva tera-fi2 because its arch is too high. She wears them in the teva ‘Women's Pretty Rugged Leather 2’, black. She has a black orthodic so it hides pretty good. But they don’t make them for men. I don’t know of a men’s sandal flat enough for an orthotic AND keep the orthotic from slipping out. My chiropractor has a sandal that can hold an orthotic but it is ridiculously heavy (40oz/pair).

So around the house/yard/store my wife wears her orthotics in the ‘pretty rugged’ sandal. But when she’s doing major hiking, she slips on the tera-fi2’s and has been fine with those; i.e., no orthotics.

May everyone find their foot zen.

-Barry

I gotta start looking a little more. My wife can hike all day in birkenstocks, but every shoe/runner I put her in for rougher terrain where you might need it she hates. need something closed toe but like birkenstocks..

Wow, I'm amazed at these replies. The first thing I notice is that no one used the word "boots." I don't know much about ultralight backpacking---I'm trying to go light rather than ultralight. I'm assuming that most of you avoid boots? I know there are ecological reasons to not wear boots, especially ones with a heavy tread.

I feel I must wear boots because I have some extra body weight and one bad ankle and need the support of boots. On my last trip there were at least 10 stream crossings. I actually timed myself and it took me about 10 minutes to take off my pack, change from boots into crocs, cross the stream, dry my feet, and put my socks and boots back on. That means that at least one hour per day was spent just changing footwear! That bugged me but I couldn't figure out any other way to do it.

I also found that constantly taking the pack off and putting it back on for stream crossings consumed quite a bit of energy. As an older person I can't afford to squander any energy. That trip convinced me to abandon my 5-lb 8-oz. Gregory Baltoro and get a pack I can actually carry.

For the moment I don't have any solutions, especially in the fall when getting wet and staying wet is not an option. To the OP: Crocs are very light, easy to clp to your pack, and a joy around camp after a long day on the trail.

If you have actual medical advice, I'm reluctant to contradict. However, there is a strong weight of opinion that one doesn't normally need "ankle support" and that such support may actually be counter productive to re-establishing strength and proper gait, as well as increasing the potential for some injuries in some situations. With lighter shoes, you are also likely to be more agile thus avoiding some potential injuries, as well.

A good orthotic in a lightweight trail shoe can be very suppportive. I can recommend Superfeet although I am now a Featherspring convert.

As you move to lighter pack weight, you'll be able to move to liighter shoes, as well. Remember 1 lb on your foot equals maybe 5 on your back.

Crocks are nice -- but around here, they are considered medium weight, not lightweight. I think they weight something like 8-9 oz?

I've always walked through streams without taking off my shoes or boots. I used to wear 5 lb Raichle Palus.

I've just never found a problem with getting my shoes or boots wet. They are usually wet with sweat anyway. The stream crossings wash off some of the salt and cool my feet down.

Yes, I have medical problems. I have sprained my ankle quite a few times. When that happens the ligaments remain perpetually vulnerable--I think they become permanently stretched. Some excess weight adds to the problem, in addition to loss of balance with age and unsteadiness due to hip arthritis. Trail shoes are not in my future.

My crocs are cheap Wal-Mart knockoffs, really featherweight. Much lighter and cheaper than the real thing.

You seem to be very efficient in getting shoes off and crossing. An hour a day does not seem so bad for crossings. I am not sure your "problem" needs a solution. I would call you an expert stream crosser already.

I think it just depends if you want to keep dry feet or not. If I am getting feet wet on the trail anyway, I just cross streams with shoes on, but occassionally wring out the wool socks. If streams are the only thing getting me wet, I will change into my crocks every time. It is tedious, but then it does feel great to cool off my feet and getting a few minutes out of the hiking shoes also feels very good.

For me it is a good excuse to take the pack off! Sounds like taking the pack off and on is the major problem for you. A lighter pack helps. In my opinion, if taking a pack off and on is a struggle, the pack is too heavy. You also may look at the way you take your pack off and put it on. Are you doing it in the most ergonomic way?

All good points, thanks. After that stream-crossing trip I did decide to reduce my load. I got a lighter backpack and summer sleeping bag, and will take my lightest tent next time. I MAY give up fresh fruits and vegetables, but that will be hard. :-))) I'm new to light packing and need to fine tune quite a few things. Yes, it can feel great to cool off your feet, but at times I encountered a stream every 15 minutes. "Tedious" is the word.

One thing I really don't understand is how you can have healthy feet after several days of wet shoes and socks. I've always considered dry feet to be essential.

I take the pack off and put it on using my knee. I found myself resenting the stiff Baltoro padding and appreciate the softer Jade 50 padding.

"One thing I really don't understand is how you can have healthy feet after several days of wet shoes and socks. I've always considered dry feet to be essential."

Dry them at the end of the day and put on dry socks, so they're wet in the daytime, but not at night.

For during the day, some folks use hydropel or bodyglide.
I have no experience at doing that; my limited experience with bodyglide to prevent blisters suggests to me that hydropel might be the better choice.

Grapple hook and rope? One time on a hiie we had a strong swimmer swim with a rope i tied to a tree and we got are gear across with the rope, and then hung upside down scooting across the rope. This was tough at a time i carried a 38+ pound pack.

I used to use a pair of Tevas. Change into them - cross - change back. One time we had about 5-6 crossings over about 3 miles or so, and the gi-normous amount of rain raised water levels to whitewater rapids level :-) Got through with the Tevas - and kept hiking in them until finished with the crossings, then changed back.

Now I have a pair of crocs for around camp - but I haven't used them yet for fording...

Hi,

from many accumulated kilometres walked in rivers and creeks on whitewater kayaking trips over many years, I can tell you one thing:

Whatever you choose to do, do NOT go barefeet, on socks, in flip-flops or crockers.

Hiking boots are best, trail running shoes or running shoes can be ok if it's not too extreme and you're careful. Where you can clearly see the ground and it's not more than knee deep, well fitting Tevas or similar can be acceptable, but the fact that they leave your toes basically unprotected means that if your foot slips forward and crashes into something sharp, the rest of your trip may be problematic and painful.

Not using proper footwear during river crossings is one of the main reasons why people fall into the water with all consequences including injury, hypothermia and drowning, and also a good example of a seriously misguided lightweight approach, imho.

I wear Falke Trekking Coolmax socks which are medium thick; where I hike, with river crossings or without, I often have wet feet all day due to serious rain. My shoes fit really well and have been worn in for quite some time, and this combination allows me to walk for days in totally wet socks and shoes without getting any serious blisters, if any.

Everyone will have to find their own best combination of socks and shoes, but I can say from my own experience that that is possible - you may just have to experiment a while until you find your own best solution.

From my experience in river reading and in walking in rivers I can clearly say that more often than not I would rather walk in soaked shoes and socks, even if it means blisters, or even turn back, than walk through with inadequate or no footwear. I have simply seen too much carnage caused by that.

Just my 2c...

Cheers,

Matt

“Hiking boots are best, trail running shoes or running shoes can be ok if it's not too extreme and you're careful. Where you can clearly see the ground and it's not more than knee deep, well fitting Tevas or similar can be acceptable, but the fact that they leave your toes basically unprotected means that if your foot slips forward and crashes into something sharp, the rest of your trip may be problematic and painful.”

Hiking boots have been a pain for me at river crossings. I gave them up a few years ago.

I do a vast majority of my backpacking in sandals. If you buy a half size larger, the ‘unprotected’ problem is SIGNIFICANTLY minimized as the sandal forefront will get stubbed instead of your toes. Also the Teva ‘spider’ rubber has MUCH better traction under water than hiking boots and most shoes. I have done several waist high muddy water crossings with Teva’s. And it was great. I don’t have to change footwear and the sandal dries fast!

The key is: make sure the sandal is tight on before the river crossing. And use hiking poles.

To invite someone to walk for days or even hike 20 miles in continuous wet socks and shoes is risky. The foot needs some breathing time so that the skin won’t soften, wrinkle, and then split and bleed. Some of our scouts have gone through that . No one, who where’s sandals, goes through that.

May everyone find their foot zen.
-Barry

I did a couple week-long canoeing/portaging/backpacking trips this spring and fall. These trips required walking through mud, streams, and into lakes. Your feel were almost always wet, I just wore a pair of running shoes that drained fairly fast and did my best to dry them once I set up camp at the end of the day. I kept one pair of socks dry to wear with sandals around camp to let my feet rest/dry every night, but other than that, I think you should be fine with having wet feet, once you get used to it. I guess it makes a difference how long we are talking and what the weather is. In may, wet feet are cold feet, especially in Canada.