Hold your fire!

What really happened here?

We were hiking in the Stanislaus National Forest over the weekend, following a series of old logging and mining roads above the Stanislaus River. These roads get some traffic, both from street legal and OHVs, and we were a little disappointed at the amount of trash we saw in a few places. One particularly area was a clearing at the top of the ridge, where people had obviously not only used it for target practice many times (there were targets on the trees, and shell casings all over the ground) but also dumped a mattress and other trash. Pretty sad.

We continued on, leaving the clearing on our left, as the road dropped around to the right and then curved back to the left where it crossed over the ridge about a hundred yards past the clearing. At that point there was an open gate, and it was posted by the USFS with large signs indicating that the road was closed to traffic after December 15th.

Good, we thought. We’re about to experience a bit of peace and quiet.

As we passed through the open gate, we heard a vehicle. Yep—a large white pick-up was driving along behind us, headed towards the gate. When it got to the gate, I walked back up to the truck, expecting to have a conversation about the fact that the road was closed to just those kinds of vehicles.

Only then they opened the doors, and I saw the USFS insignias there.

Oops.

So we had a very nice conversation about the roads and the area—and the two USFS employees explained that there were there to close the gate for the season. They had come out two weekends ago to do the same thing, but discovered that the back side of the gate had no reflective tape. They were concerned that someone might run into it at night from the back, and so they had returned with rolls of tape. (There are some operating mines in the area, so we assumed that the miners would have access to their claims, even during the closed season?)

At any rate, after wishing each other well, we left the rangers to their taping and locking of the gate, and we wandered along the road for another mile or so.

About when turned around, we heard some shots behind us, and we guessed that someone was now using the clearing to test their firearms, or make America free. Something like that.

So we cautiously approached that section of the road, although by now the firing had ceased. We found the gate closed and locked, but with only a few strips of tape on the back side. But on the ground were rolls of reflective tape, a pair of scissors, and strips of paper backing from that tape on the gate.

Huh.

So we walked back up to the clearing, and found the USFS truck there, and another SUV. The rangers were talking to the people from the SUV, who were clearly the ones doing the shooting. As we arrived, I saw a citation clipboard in one of the ranger’s hands, and she was filling something out there. Meanwhile, as we arrived, one of the men from the SUV saw us, and turned to the ranger to ask if they could start shooting again.

She told him to wait for the Sheriff to arrive.

We said hello to the rangers, reminded them that their tape and trash were down by the gate (they were on top of that) and started walking back out to our cabin. About fifteen minutes later we met two Sheriff squad cards, two officers in each, passing us and heading out to meet with the USFS rangers.

So our thoughts:

The rangers were a hundred yards down-range from the shooters, and below the horizon. I can only imagine their reaction when the shooting started. I assume that they yelled (although we didn’t hear anything) and ran back up to the clearing in their truck.

Were the shooters cited? If so, what was the citation for? Unsafe operation of a firearm? If so, how does someone at that clearing avoid violating that law? They were on top of a ridge! Even if they had walked down-range and notified the USFS team, and then waited for them to leave---they still would have had us down-range a few minutes later.

(Don’t worry---if we had heard shots on the way back, we were prepared to yell our heads off.)

There was another clearing on this same ridge, a half-mile earlier, and it clearly get used the same way. So this isn’t just a single incident or place. That are these shooters thinking? It would seem to me that there would be justification for posting something about No Shooting in these areas, since they are, by definition, unsafe.

On the other hand, on the North side of the ridge is a very well defined cut in the hill, where the road makes a tight turn into the cut. The cut makes an ideal background for target practice, and that spot gets lots of use from firearm fans. The only way to approach it is from along the road, which is always behind the shooters, as the cut is into a very steep ridge that towers over the road. So it’s not as if the shooters don’t have another place to go.

What are your thoughts?

Certain forest areas have certain regulations. Maybe they were shooting trees? I saw one in North Carolina where you cannot use a tree as bullet stopper.

Edit: Shooting Regulations

My thoughts are shooting for practice or for sport should be at a designated clearly marked shooting range. To shoot a gun off without a care as to where the bullet ends up should be a criminal offense. These people should have there firearms taken away, jailed & fined for just being stupid.
I must admit, I was Very Stupid Once..

In our area shooting must take place a certain distance from a road or dwelling. If they were shooting from the road side that may be a legal violation. If the USFS folks were attending to a gate they surely should not have been in the line of fire. It would be inexcusable to be shooting across a roadway. IMO if the Sheriffs office was responding they were going to have more than just a chat with them.

This scenario is why I find it ever more urgent to urge folks to use organized shooting ranges. If your not hunting there isn't any reason why you cant have just as much fun shooting and be that much less of a hazard to others. With all the negative views of firearms these days it also creates a heck of a lot less controversy. Glad you stayed out of harms way.

Bottom line we are at the mercy of the lowest common denominator of john q public's common sense.

Well, if you aren't taught basic gun etiquette / safety growing up, you have to learn on your own. And if you are a (usually) early 20-something and you want to learn, you usually don't ask or take lessons... This is a downside of households not teaching it - I'm not saying you have to have guns in your house! I'm just saying it would be nice if people taught their kids basics and there was less fear mongering.

Just my 2 cents and YMMV!!

Yep--although these folks were well past their twenties...closer to sixty than twenty.

I'm thinking shooting bottles and thus leaving debris/littering or like was mentioned, shooting at trees. Nothing wrong with shooting in the forest, target practicing as far as I know. May have been shooting across a road. Without info from them or the FS, we can only guess what happened and why the law was called. Obviously the FS people there were not LE personnel or they could have handled it themselves.
Duane

If you want to see disgusting check out tanerite (sp?) on you tube. This explosive target is going to kill some one, not to mention the trash people leave behind from stuff they are blowing up. TVs, toilets, camping trailers. Its really sad. I'm teaching my son how to shoot and the great responsibility that comes with it. We pick up every target, casings, trash, even stuff left by others. Seems to be a lot of idiots out there.

I always presume anybody with a gun doesn't know Shinola--it's definitely a lowest common denominator issue since the round doesn't know the IQ of the person propelling it into the ether. Pretty much everybody I know who carries/carried a weapon as a profession rolls their eyes at the typical gun enthusiast.

A note on making your presence known--given unknowable acoustics and the possibility the shooters are wearing earplugs, never, ever, ever assume you will be heard when shouting at the top of your lungs. I usually carry a whistle, but even that is sketchy at times, dissipating after a short distance in the woods.

But I think there is something wrong with shooting where you have no idea what is downrange, no?

rule # 1 with guns is know your background. I've passed a few very nice bucks because I wasn't sure what would happen if I missed. As a gun enthusiast I could never forgive myself if someone, or animal be hurt or killed because I didn't think about where my bullet goes. It's really pretty simple and I find those who don't understand this simple rule should never touch a gun or knife for that matter.