Down bag compression

How small should you compress a down bag (850+ fill WM bag)? How long is it safe to keep it compressed?

Are there some guidelines somewhere or is it pure superstition and old wives tales? I read nothing about it on the Feathered Friends or Western Mountaineering websites.

I plan on keeping mine either hanging up in the closest or in the storage bag, but I wasn't sure what the guidelines were when actually on a hike or in luggage enroute.

Thank ya'll again,

Nitrosteel

I have no scientific information as far as how much harm is done to the bag etc. My personal philosophy is leave it uncompressed whenever possible. I will compress mine quite a bit and place it into the bottom of my pack the night before I go camping. When I return from my overnight adventure or two I turn it inside out, air it out, and place it back in its regular large storage bag. I don’t worry about it much. I bought it to use, and when it is no longer usable I will buy another.

Howie

“How small should you compress a down bag (850+ fill WM bag)? How long is it safe to keep it compressed?”

WM comes with nice moisture resistant stuff sacks. I wouldn’t stuff it smaller than that.
I try to not let it go for more than a day compressed. The more days it stays compressed, the longer it takes to fluff.
There are times where I traveled and it stayed stuffed for a week. The bags recovered but I got very paranoid for leaving it that long. I also do not know of any scientific investigation done on extended storage of compressed down.

-Barry

I compress mine and stuff it in my backpack the night before I leave for a trip. I leave it compressed during the day when hiking, and fluff it out at night of course. When I come home
it comes out first thing, and gets fluffed up and put in a large storage bag where it can sit fluffed up. I find my bags lose a *little* loft in the first year if kept this way, but are pretty consistant
after that, and I don't have too many problems with them.

I personally don't worry about crunching them down to carry them. as long as I don't store them
that way long term.

I'm with Phat and Howie - You have to do what you have to do on the trail which means that the bag will spend some time crunched down. And when I get home I air it out and store it in the giant storage sack.

But, I'm assuming that what you really want to know is how small can a down bag be crushed without doing any permanent damage. And, as you asked, how long can it be kept compressed.

While I can't directly address the question of "how small can it be compessed", I can say that my bags sometimes spend alot of time compressed with no noticable degradation.

Last year I spent 4 months on a RTW (round the world) trip. Which meant that my WM Super Versalite spent alot of time compressed in the bottom of my pack. I took nothing that wouldn't fit in my 3600 cu in pack. While I don't use a compression sack I do compress it down fairly small. The bag also got used alot (which, in my opinion, may do more long term compression damage than stuffing - since you lie on top of the down crmpressing it essentially flat). I have since been on a couple of backpacking trips using that same bag and I haven't noticed any degradation at all.

I also have an older (25 year old) down 15 degree Northface bag. That bag has seen alot of action. While it is not as lofty as it was when it was new - it's still lofts up pretty darn well and is still very warm.

So, again, I'd say use the bag - do whatever you have to do (within reason) to fit it into your pack and, if my experience is any indication, even with alot of use (and/or alot of time spent compressed) your bag should last a good long time.

rionada

Nitro

May I? <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> the problem with compressing (dry) down is that you can break the backs of the feathers by putting permanent kinks in them. Only over compression can do this. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> That said - once they are permanently bent - they will NOT completely recover - ever. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Personally - I never compress my down much at all - I have a HUGE spectra pack and I have no need for ANY stuff sacks at all. Never compressing the down is the best way. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Next to that - compressing it in its factory stuff sack should be the minimum. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> BTW you can save a bit of weight by not using stuff sacks. My big Kelty is a big sack with one pocket on the top. I just shove everything in and go, makes for fast packing up. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I have no problem with putting it into its factory stuff sack and leaving it, because I feel that once its stuffed it isn't gonna hurt it anymore to stay that way - maybe I'm wrong, but I think ultimately the critical factor in "wearing out your down" is not how long it stays compressed, but rather the number of times you compress it. The idea being that everytime you highly compress it, you add new wrinkles. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Stuffing a down bad wet is the worst, so again with my huge pack I just shove a wet bag into my pack without compressing it. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />
<img src="/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
BTW there are a lot of things you can do to keep a bag dry including pressing all of the warm damp <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />air out of it as soon as you get out of it. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />
Jim YMMV <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Off-topic for the thread, but is your Spectra a variation of one of my packs called the Flight? It is the version that has the removable side pockets and "shovel" pocket on the back. A great feature when you need variable c.i. depending on your load and needs.

Grit:

Way, way off-topic, but I saw some clips of the flood in Ruidoso yesterday -- you okay there?

Grit
Actually my pack is a Kelty White Cloud 6500. All of the accessory stuff is nice. I can strip it down to just a sack with shoulder straps and a thin waist band, or add a large waist band, external pockets, shovel carrier, top pocket, and even the compression straps are modular. At 29 ounces in Summer mode for 6000 inches is way light.
Jim <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I don't have any evidence to support this, but I think that "compression" is a matter of degrees. I think you can squish it a bit by hand and not break down the fibers, but if you're standing on it or using a compression sack you're going to do some damage. I compress mine as little in my pack as possible and store it uncompressed. It packs small anyway and I have plenty of room. Also, a mushy marshmallow packs easier and fills gaps better than a slightly smaller bowling ball.

doesn't laying on it compress down to the max? If so wouldn't you ruin a down jacket if you where to sleep with one to lower the rating of a certain bag or just ruin the down thats on the underside of you in your bag? How does laying on it compare to compressing it in your bag? Since when you roll around with your bag aren't you compressing the down from the sides as well and not just the down on the bottom? So wouldn't that break the fibers?
I just got my first down bag this year and try to take good care of it by only compress it enough to fit in its supplied stuff sack. I also baby it by only putting it in the stuff sack at the trail head and not on the drive to the trail head. Then when I get back to the car take it out of the stuff sack and put it in the storage sack for the ride home. This way it doesn't spend extra time compressed. Is this a bit much?

Cesar -

Sounds a little over the top to me, but hey if it's workin' for ya...

In my experience down is pretty resilient. Like I stated earlier - I have a 25 year old down bag that's seen plenty of use, plenty of stuffing and unstuffing, and plenty of time in a stuff sack and it has held up very well. (It's still the warmest bag I own - it has more loft than my WM versalite, but it weighs almost 4 pounds).

So, again, I'd say go ahead and use it - down can take alot.

rionada

Technically since I use a down quilt, I'm not compressing it while asleep.

jaiden
quote
doesn't laying on it compress down to the max?
end quote

NO. Try laying on a feather. What happens - it flattens out - feathers are supposed to be flat. Now take it and squeeze it into a tiny spit ball, then straighten it out again - it won't be like the flattened one anymore. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

You will lose some loft from "new condition" but down can be used extensively for decades. That said - I HAVE had a down bag lose its loft but it was from washing it incorrectly. Perhaps only water can destroy a down bag, and you are 80% water.
Jim <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Makes sense. So are you supposed to roll your sleeping bag or just stuff it in the stuff stack? For storage I'm assuming you can just stuff it since its not really compressing anyhow.

I use a trash compactor bag in the bottom of my pack - sleeping bag, dry bivy, and sleeping clothes go in there. That way they stay dry and not compressed. I had a bag a long time ago, and I sqeezed the crap out of it in a compression stuff sack. It never seemed to hurt it. I always stored it in the big bag it came with. That bag lasted 15 years before the fabric began to give out.