Dazed And Confused About Shoe Sizing

The recent post about wide trail shoes got me thinking. My favorite hiking shoe is the Montrail Hardrock wide size 11. My question is-why do I have to get the wide size to get a proper fit? When I measure my foot with the Brannock device at the sporting goods store I get a D width-that's not wide, that's normal. When I get normal width cheap shoes for around town, they seem too narrow. I mail ordered some expensive normal width Saucony running shoes and had to return them for being too narrow. Are people's feet getting narrower as time goes on? Is a D width now considered wide? Is the Brannock device out of date? Are shoe companies saving costs by making shoes narrower. Am I going crazy and imagining all this?

The foot can change shape and size as you get older. Also there are many different "lasts" (that wooden foot shaped model used to build a shoe around it) and they all have a different volume on any given size.
See here for details :
http://www.footjoy.com.au/customerservice/shoes_fitting.asp
So when a brand switches the order to a different factory you can end up with a different sized shoe . That is why I would not buy a shoe on the Net, I still occasionally get it wrong AFTER I have tried them on.
Franco

I've been selling shoes for almost three years and one thing I can tell you is that the brannock device isn't always right. It is a good guideline for measurement, but I have measured many feet to be a D width that end up needing a wide shoe. It only measures the width of the foot in one spot.

Everyday I get customers asking questions like, "What's the best shoe you sell?" or "Which hiking boot is the most comfortable?" It all comes down to how they fit, that is and always be the most important thing in finding the right shoe for yourself. They read great reviews in some magazine or newspaper about a shoe or boot and just assume that it will work great for them.

Ultimately, it all comes down to trying each shoe on in multiple sizes and widths to find the one that fits your foot the best.

I would love to buy shoes on the net but am also leary about doing so. When my foot was measured the device measured a C. After shopping for cloths a couple weeks ago I found that pants and shirts had the same problem. Had to return 2 shirts and 1 pr of shorts. All were the same measurements according to the tags.

Anyone who has ever sold shoes can tell you that shoe sizes vary from one manufacturer to another and even one model of shoe to another. I sold boots and shoes in three different mountain shops for several years, and I only used the measuring device as a rough starting point for fitting. For some people, I had to ignore the thing. And for some people, I actually had to lie about what size they were trying on because they would be adamant that they wear a certain size and nothing else wil fit. Only after they had it on and were saying how good it felt, and we had done all the usual tests for fit, would I admit what size it really was - and then some of them would decide that it didn't feel so good after all.
As for widths, it has always been the case that some shoe manufacturers opt for a wider last than others. Some use a C width as their standard, others use D. Also, their is a wide range of volume in different lasts, and volume plays a part in width fitting. In other words, if two feet are the same width but one is thicker (higher volume) then the two feet will not fit the same shoes, despite the brannock device reading the same width. This is due to measuring in only two dimensions when the foot is a three-dimensional object, and a complex one at that. What I learned from fitting a lot of feet in lot of boots and shoes is that it doesn't matter what it says on the box, you just have to keep trying them on until you find one that fits. There is no need to measure your foot to find a shoe that fits - it just saves time by reducing the amount of trial and error it takes to find the right pair.
Some who has fit a lot of feet and really knows the shoes they have in the store can find you the right shoe pretty quickly with a quick look at your feet, measurement or no.

The only way I can find hiking shoes is to try on each one in at least four sizes. I'm usually in the men's department, too, since those crazy people at Merrell, Keen and Saloman believe that all women have narrow, flat feet.

How true! You are lucky that you fit into men's sizes. I'm stuck with what they offer in women's sizes - 80% too narrow in the fore-foot and toes. So many times I have found a shoe that at least looks like what I want only to find out it is in men's only, size 7 minimum!

Leaving my normal lurk mode here as I sold shoes for many years when I was young. Another thing that many people over look when fitting shoes is the arch length. The brannock device does measure this but most people just use that little slider to check width. It can make a huge difference as the length and width may be a 9D, but if the arch length is an 11, the shoe will never fit correctly. It might take an 11B to get the right fit. Yes, you can get the heat moldable supports, but that only deals with the bottom of the shoe. The sides and top are also affected by arch length. There are so many variables that it is simply not possible to measure them all accurately. For that reason, it is a good thing that different companies use different lasts. That way, we can each find a shoe that fits our particular feet. I would suggest that if you find a boot that works good for you, one that remains comfortable on the long days, buy at least a second pare of them. I would buy three if I could find one that worked for me. So far, the closest thing has been the Hi- techs I am currently killing, but at the end of a long day, they are only bearable.

ken

Paul
"And for some people, I actually had to lie about what size they were trying on "

this reminds me of the comedy sketch where the salesman asks the young lady "shall we play around for a while with size 6 or shall we go directly to size 8 ?"
Franco

Clearly and well said.

"If the shoe fits, wear it" unless you would prefer to wear footwear that fits poorly, but is in "your size" nevertheless.

You are so right about the arch length. I for one have short toes. If you measure my feet for overall length and arch length, you come up a size or a size and a half different. So boots and shoes that fit me correctly have lots more extra room at the toes than most people have.

Yeah another thing to keep in mind is that many people have two different size feet. Many people will just measure one foot and not the other one.

You have to size to the larger foot, which seems to me is generally the left foot. If it is only a half size difference you're probably okay with one pair of shoes. Although, I've seen people who have had to buy two pairs of the same shoe in different sizes (one in size 8, the other in 9.5).

Maybe I should be in the womens dept. looking at the narrow shoes. Most of the men's sizes seem wide for me. I was measured as a C width. Maybe they are a little more stylish than the clunkers I been wearing. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Chaz
Now that you are out I feel more comfortable recommending this type of shoes for you, narrow and with limited but adequate ankle support. They also come in gold, if you prefer.
Warning : they are not compatible with most crampons, so better avoid snow and ice with them
Franco