Sleeping Cold in my WM Ultralite ???

I feel like I just took two steps backwards are far as being prepared for the elements. I have to admit ahead of time, I kinda rushed into this last minute hike.
Last Thursday I hiked up to Chickenfoot Lake in the Little Lakes Valley for just a couple days. According to a few backpackers I met going in, the temps were 30 degree's the night before and a little colder the previous night. It was only a 5 mile hike but at 10700', I was really burned out for the rest of the day. I ended up reluctantly going to bed around 6 pm and didn't sleep well at all. Woke up cold, put on all my cloths over my thermals, yet just couldn't get warm for the entire night.
A couple of years ago, I purchased the WM Ultralite which is rated at 20 degree's. It has served me well so far with only a few nights in the low 30's. I usually use a foam pad from walmart, but ended up using my Big Agnes Air Core Pad instead. I also use a piece of Tyvek to fit under my Eureka Spitfire UL tent. So I guess my question is what am I doing wrong ??? Any suggestions or is it just me.... ??

If your BA mat is the non insulated type, there is your problem.
Franco

+1

+2 on the pad.

A plain air pad with no insulation will get cold in the 40's F. The air inside gets chilled from the ground and the air, and conducts heat away from your body. Every time you move, you stir up the air in the pad, bringing more cold air in contact with your body. Even for an Insulated Air Core, freezing (32*F) is close to borderline. By the time you get into the 20's F, you need a pad with R5 insulation, or a closed-cell foam pad placed on top of the Insulated Air Core pad.

I went through this a couple of years ago trying to use a NeoAir at 18* temps. When I laid still long enough to find out, I was plenty warm on the top and shivering on the side next to the NeoAir!

Seems like I remember reading where someone here had experimented with using Reflectix under an air pad. I dont remember who it was or what the results were though.

You said you were burned out and went to bed around 6:00. Did you drink enough water on the way in, and did you cook and eat supper before turning in? If not, those could be contributing factors.

More likely is the BA Air Core pad - just like everyone else said, it's no good in colder temperatures, and I had the BA Insulated Air Core pad let the cold through at about 35 degrees.

And, just to nail down all the loose boards, if you were using the insulated pad, did you have the maroon side on top? I believe the insulation is attached to that side, and hangs down to be effective - if you used it upside down, the insulation didn't "fluff" properly. (Anyhow that's what the local outfitter asked when I told him what happened to me.)

Number one item is check the pad (as many others have said).

Number two is how was your body doing at the time. If you push yourself too hard, sometimes it is hard for the core body temps to come back up even if you refuel. I would guess that this is the thing most do poorly, that is monitoring yourself physically. Sometimes you just have to stop and get yourself "back in order" again before continuing on.

sK

P.S. A number three; I am a big guy and I have noticed that my WM ultralight (rated to 20 degrees) works great, but I do have to be a little careful about loft distribution otherwise I get cold spots. My heavier bags never have this problem.

Wearing a really warm hat to bed like a fur lined mad bomber, will allow you to sleep warm at 20 degrees colder with the same outfit.

I'll join the others and opine your problem was 90% the air mattress. Uninsulated mattresses on cold ground will pull heat away from your body pronto. You can get away with one if you're sleeping on thick, dry forest duff since it can be a pretty good insulator, but that's something I never see at 10k feet, myself. A very thin (1/8-inch) foam pad would probably add enough warmth to keep using the air mattress, otherwise I'd suggest an insulated mattress instead.

Sleeping atop your pack or any other available soft gear might have helped that night. Also, do you know the Ultralite trick of shifting the down to the top for colder nights? It has continuous baffles to help widen its temperature range (very helpful for warm nights).

FWIW I've had my Ultra comfortably below 20; it's a bag I trust.

Cheers,

Shifting the down in the Ultralite only works if you don't turn over! Otherwise, you are better off to make sure the down is distributed evenly in each baffle. I've found I need to check mine every couple of days.

I've taken the Ultralite down to 15*F, wearing my jacket and a fleece balaclava, and--with a well-insulated pad--was very comfortable. That 1/8" foam that was suggested won't be enough with an uninsulated air pad and may not be enough with some insulated air pads.

With the Ultralite, it's also important to tighten up the draft collar really snugly around the neck. With the draft collar tight, I was able to keep the hood loose so I wasn't breathing into the down (something you never want to do!).

It is really important in cold weather to eat a hot meal and have a hot drink in the evening, preferably something with some fat in it which your body will metabolize slowly during the night. It's also important to be hydrated (dehydration contributes a lot to both altitude sickness and hypothermia). You may also have been suffering from a lack of electrolytes on your climb. A high carbohydrate diet also helps with the altitude. Finally, even 5 minutes of vigorous exercise just before crawling into bed will get your metabolism stoked up so you'll have enough body heat to warm up the sleeping bag. I learned all this the hard way!

Thanks to everyone for your replies. Looks like this non insulated air pad is the problem. I figured the tyvek would be enough but I guess I learned the hard way. I did drink a litter of water before I started the trip and close to a litter during the trip along with some electrolyte mix, had dinner as well. Felt like I was coming down with something but was fine the next day. It was only a 5 mile hike but the elevation along with the pad were more then likely the culprit. Thanks everyone for your help.. Stay warm..

Om is right on about eating. I sleep cold and have a +12F rated bag. When I was in Yosemite (7K and +15F) and woke up cold, half a Clif Bar or some chocolate would do the trick. Seems trivial, but made all the difference. As already mentioned, wear a hat like a Turtlefur beanie or a balaclava if you can stand one (I like them during the day, not so much at night), light gloves and socks. I also tossed my parka over my bag, that helped quite a bit.

I was using two pads-a Ridgerest closed cell foam pad under a Thermorest, both are full length.

I did this to myself earlier in the year.

I tried to just carry a foam pad and the uninsulated pad. I was cold in my 15 degree down bag.

I was successful with a foam pad and a spaceblanket on the ground, wrapping the space blanket around the air mattress (foil side in, if it matters) with a bivy sack on top of that, and a poncho liner wrapped around both me and my 40 degree bag. I was wearing a lot of clothes. I don't recommend this solution from a weight perspective.

A simple search pretty much sums up almost all the advice in this post. Thanks again for everyones help..
http://www.chiff.com/a/camping-sleep-warm.htm

I don't like the idea of having a liquid of any kind in my bag, so I would ignore those tips. Other than that, he's pretty much summed up what we've been talking about.

With the advice from OregonMouse who had used a POE InsulMat, an older version of the Ether Thermo,I purchased a newer model POE Elite from a shop in Vancouver. There are two models, one with synthetic insulation throughout, which is 20oz, and the model I purchased, which has insulation just under the core, which weighs 15oz. This pad is really comfortable down to freezing,but for your situation I would get the fully insulated pad. The POE Elite is a viable alternative to Big Agnes and to Thermarest pads. There's newer models now, all a bit heavier (go figure) but still lighter than most of the competition.